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Thread: The Biggins Family.

  1. #51
    Peppermint Patterson EVOO's Avatar
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    Looks like we'll be seeing more of the Biggins family on another reality TV show on FOX:

    FOX to premiere "Renovate My Family" 09/07
    "I only run if I'm being chased" (Dominique- Making the Band 3)

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by EVOO
    No, I admit I totally cringed when she asked it, but to be fair to her, she did state that she didn't know and apologized beforehand, so that scored a few points (albeit not many) in my book.
    I found the question appalling. If Mela is able to learn the skills needed to work in a hospital, shouldn't she know the diversity that exists on every continent?

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill747
    Originally Posted by Frostelized
    I'm just assuming this, but she probably knows that France, Germany, etc. are all in Europe and that they speak their respective languages. It just confused me as to why she would think Asia was any different. (The best guess I can think is because supposedly all asians look the same, and she thought Taiwan, Korea, etc. were states just like the USA ) But another point I want to make w/ that question was it proved she's never heard of the Japanese language, the Korean language, etc. And it's just a bit shocking.

    In defense of Mela, I'm sure she did not intentionally mean any disrespect to Asians by her question. She may be confused because people in Taiwan and China do speak the same language (Chinese). And people in North Korea and South Korea speak the same language (Korean).

    Moreover, Chinese/Japanese/Korean are related languages. Although totally different verbally, but in written form the 3 languages are similiar. Chinese & Japanese share 40% of root words. Chinese & Korean share 60 % of root words. So an educated Korean can easily communicate with an educated Chinese by writing. So Mela was more insightful than she realized.

    I wish you had named the country (possibly India) instead of defaming the whole continent with a broad stroke. Asia is a large continent, the largest on earth.
    The status of women varies greatly among Asian countries. From highly industrialized Japan & Korea, westernized Singapore & Hong Kong, to Muslim Arab countries, to backward rural India. In China, although communism has not done well as an economic system, it has promoted women's rights legally and culturally further than many other countries.

    As for the Nakamuras, I think it's more a family thing instead of a cultural thing. In Japan, the daughter-in-law (Tammy) would be doing most of the household chores and serving the grand-mother (Nana), instead of the other way around.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "Women hold up half the sky". Mao Tse-tung.

    First, to Froste's comment about Asians looking the same, any educated person can tell and see the differences between Asian nationalities. Does an Ainu Japanese look the same as a mainstream Japanese, Filipino, Turkish, Arab, or East Indian person? Of course not.

    Second, to Bill's comment, calling all of India rural is wrong. India has large cities as well as farms. Also, women's rights have progressed farther in democracies than in any communist country. Why quote Mao, who murdered millions, in the first place? I don't understand.

    Third, Bill's comment about defending Mela is completely incorrect. Korean and Japanese are unique languages, whereas Chinese is in the Sino-Tibetan language family. They are COMPLETELY different. The only language family that comes close to Korean and Japanese is possibly the Uralic group. Don't forget that within Chinese, Mandarin and Cantonese speakers don't even understand each other, because those dialects are so different from each other. :rolleyes

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlemermaid
    to Bill's comment, (1) calling all of India rural is wrong. India has large cities as well as farms. Also, (2) women's rights have progressed farther in democracies than in any communist country. (3) Why quote Mao, who murdered millions, in the first place? I don't understand.
    Third, Bill's comment about defending Mela is completely incorrect. (4) Korean and Japanese are unique languages, whereas Chinese is in the Sino-Tibetan language family. They are COMPLETELY different. The only language family that comes close to Korean and Japanese is possibly the Uralic group. (5) Don't forget that within Chinese, Mandarin and Cantonese speakers don't even understand each other, because those dialects are so different from each other.
    (1) I did NOT call all of India rural. I said parts of rural India is backward, especially with respect to women's rights.
    (2) I don't want to turn this thread into a political argument but you are confused with respect to even basic terms. Eg. you mixed up communism vs capitalism with dictatorship vs democracy; the formers are economic systems whereas the latter are political structures. There are examples, as in Chile, where the Marxist government was democratically elected by the people and the capitalist dictatorship was installed by a military coup.
    (3) One can also argue Truman "murdered millions" by dropping atomic bombs in Hiroshima and Nakasaki, eventhough it quickly ended WWII. Mao may have done many bad things, but in terms of women's right he was instrumental in taking China from feudualism to near equality for women.
    (4) You don't know what you are talking about. If you understand Japanese or Korean then you would know parts of these languages are based on Chinese characters/words.
    (5) Written Chinese is uniform throughout China. Mandarin and Cantonese are dialects, spoken Chinese. A Mandarin speaker can communicate with a Cantonese speaker perfectly by writing. These dialects are NOT completely different from each other. They are similiar in much the same way Cockney English is similiar to Texan English.
    Last edited by Bill747; 08-11-2004 at 01:18 AM.
    "The greatest myth in the world is that beauty equals goodness." Leo Tolstoy

  5. #55
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    (I can bet you one thing: I am sure that Mela would have never imagined that her innocent question would spark this kind of debate. And, BTW, at least she asked, instead of staying ignorant.

    The intent of her question was not to offend and maybe that is what you need to look at in this situation.

    Great points Bill! [great quote too!])
    "Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening." - Greta Garbo


  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlemermaid
    ...Third, Bill's comment about defending Mela is completely incorrect. Korean and Japanese are unique languages, whereas Chinese is in the Sino-Tibetan language family. They are COMPLETELY different.
    I said: "Chinese & Japanese share 40% of root words."
    You said: They are "COMPLETELY different" languages.

    The experts say:
    "The influence of the Chinese language on Japanese remains apparent today-approximately 40% of the vocabulary of modern Japanese consists of words adapted from Chinese."
    History of Japanese language - 3rd paragraph
    http://www.alsintl.com/languages/japanese.htm
    Last edited by Bill747; 08-11-2004 at 12:29 PM.
    "The greatest myth in the world is that beauty equals goodness." Leo Tolstoy

  7. #57
    FORT Fanatic divaexpatriate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlemermaid
    Second, to Bill's comment, calling all of India rural is wrong. India has large cities as well as farms. Also, women's rights have progressed farther in democracies than in any communist country. Why quote Mao, who murdered millions, in the first place? I don't understand.
    Sorry, but that is untrue. Communism liberated women in China: the regime obolished rampant prostitution, encouraged education and equal rights for women (ever heard of the Mao quote "women hold up half the sky" ?). My grandmother (not grandfather) *fought* in World War II, was actually captured by the Japanese at one point, and escaped by climbing over a fence!

    I wonder how many people know this side of the story. Does that make them ignorant? We all get our education, our "facts" from limited, biased sources. I don't feel at all bad that Mela asked the question that she did... well, I feel bad for her that she asked on national TV so that we could all sit around judging her. But ignorance is not the same as stupidity. She asked a question, she got an answer. I'm sure through her friendship with Nana, she will increase her knowledge of Japanese history and culture. She's open to new experiences, new people, and new things... that's a lot more than some book learned curmudgeons who wield the few facts they know as weapons to further their own limited worldviews.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill747

    (1) I did NOT call all of India rural. I said parts of rural India is backward, especially with respect to women's rights.
    (3) One can also argue Truman "murdered millions" by dropping atomic bombs in Hiroshima and Nakasaki, eventhough it quickly ended WWII. Mao may have done many bad things, but in terms of women's right he was instrumental in taking China from feudualism to near equality for women.
    (4) You don't know what you are talking about. If you understand Japanese or Korean then you would know parts of these languages are based on Chinese characters/words.
    (5) Written Chinese is uniform throughout China. Mandarin and Cantonese are dialects, spoken Chinese. A Mandarin speaker can communicate with a Cantonese speaker perfectly by writing. These dialects are NOT completely different from each other. They are similiar in much the same way Cockney English is similiar to Texan English.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill747
    __________________
    "The greatest myth in the world is that beauty equals goodness." Leo Tolstoy
    Your quote's naive. Looks may not be everything, but they sure do count a lot in today's world. Yuki may have liked Tam's personality, but he probably would not have married her if she looked less than she did. Also, more attractive people can get away with doing things more often.



    1. So are parts of rural China (e.g. female infanticide, forced abortions, etc.), so why just target India? That means that post is being biased against India.
    3. They were thousands, and that act saved more lives than extended years of conflict would have. Also, the Axis weren't exactly the good guys. You said yourself that Mao had done evil things like the extermination of tens of millions of lives. History has been kinder to capitalistic democracies than totalitarian communist governments. Quoting Mao to many of the Chinese is like quoting Hitler to many Jewish people.
    5. No, written Chinese is not uniform. Here's what your post said earlier:

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill747

    She may be confused because people in Taiwan and China do speak the same language (Chinese). Moreover, Chinese/Japanese/Korean are related languages. Although totally different verbally, but in written form the 3 languages are similiar. Chinese & Japanese share 40% of root words. Chinese & Korean share 60 % of root words. So an educated Korean can easily communicate with an educated Chinese by writing. So Mela was more insightful than she realized.
    to Muslim Arab countries
    "Women hold up half the sky". Mao Tse-tung.

    Linguistically, Cantonese is a more conservative dialect than Mandarin. They are written using very similar characters, but in Mandarin their pronunciation is quite different, whereas in Cantonese they are pronounced identically except for the respective tones .
    http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Cantonese_language
    Also, Korean and Japanese are not in the same language family as Chinese, which your earlier post suggested.
    Proper classification of Korean is not universally agreed on, but it is often considered by many to be a language isolate. Some linguistics also group it in Altaic family of languages.
    http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Korean_language

    Your post's defense of Mela's ignorance was wrong.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by divaexpatriate
    Sorry, but that is untrue. Communism liberated women in China: the regime obolished rampant prostitution, encouraged education and equal rights for women (ever heard of the Mao quote "women hold up half the sky" ?).
    Communism has led to the death of millions of people all over this world. It's also caused economic suffering and failure in the countries it's found in. Women are freer in capitalistic democracies, plain and simple.


    Quote Originally Posted by divaexpatriate
    My grandmother (not grandfather) *fought* in World War II, was actually captured by the Japanese at one point, and escaped by climbing over a fence!
    This isn't too relevant to the subject at hand.



    Also, Mela may have been ignorant about Asia, but the point is that she did not have to ask Yuki. She could have researched it on her own. :rolleyes

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by divaexpatriate
    ... that's a lot more than some book learned curmudgeons who wield the few facts they know as weapons to further their own limited worldviews.
    You have catapulted yourself into hero status with this statement! BRAVO! BRAVO!
    All things beautiful do not have to be full of color to be noticed; in
    life that which is unnoticed has the most power.

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