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Thread: 1/24 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

  1. #141
    Forum Assistant sweetpea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by busilis32;2219767;
    I am sorry, but you make bacon avocado ice cream for me, and you will never set foot again in my kingdom.
    I'm with you on that one! I like my ice cream sweet, thank you very much. What's so bad about good old vanilla?

  2. #142
    FORT Fogey miadora's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by busilis32;2219767;
    It seems that the producers knew Marcel was going to win all along, and they just avoided painting him as a villain. You almost never saw why he was so irritant, and I refuse to believe the dislike almost all the finalists felt for him was completely baseless. It seems the judges were trying to avoid having another Jeffrey (from Project Runway). They revealed too much of Jeffrey's nastiness, and he alienated a large segment of the audience. With Marcel, they seem to have gone in the completely opposite direction, but they overdid it. Personally, I don't care for the show anymore. I thought Ilan had potential, but he is just too consumed by his hatred of Marcel. And Marcel is just too annoying with that know-it-all attitude that is not really supported by what he has done. I am sorry, but you make bacon avocado ice cream for me, and you will never set foot again in my kingdom.
    Maybe Ilan is the actual "Jeffrey"...

  3. #143
    Read The Clue Bearcata's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetpea;2219307;
    I realize, all the other chef's disliking him most likely means he is indeed a selfish little jerk who has zero social skills. It's amazing to me, then, that he could run circles around these other morons and make them look to be the bigger jerks because of how they reacted to him. People like Betty, Ilan, Cliff, Sam and Frank need to grow up. Oh, and Elia, grow up too.
    I honestly think that Elia had a problem with Marcel but she did not know how to say it. Seriously, if you go to the trouble of saying Marcel is a cheat say so and give an example. Say that on such and such challenge he did this and it was against the rules and I saw him do it. If you cannot stand up in front of the judges table and say that then don't do it. Here I was all excited waiting to hear that Marcel did this and that and what did I get; mumbling. Did Elia and Ilan honestly think the judges would take their word on it. They asked for examples and you could not give them any. I would have respected them alot more it both Elia and Ilan and given several examples. It looked as if Ilan was also egging Elia on and trying not to take any responsiblity (the entire feel of season 2 had this undercurrent of surviving instead of excelling). If Elia thought Marcel was cheating she should have gone to a production assistant and insisted in talking to the producers and inform them of what is going on instead of that trainwreck that happened at the judges panel. The producers have cameras there they can look and see what is going on.
    "When life gives you lemons, squirt lemon juice in your enemy's eyes."

  4. #144
    FORT Fogey
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    I take Elia for her word. She didn't have a problem with Marcel because he wasn't a threat to her. So she thought. Since the final 4 elimination we saw was the water downed edited version. I think Elia got an indication from the judges that they had problems with her dishes. They probably praised Marcel glowingly which was edited out. So during deliberations, Elia finally felt threaten. Too little too late.

  5. #145
    Ms Ambusher dberk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetpea;2219307;
    Marcel has been trashed on continually throughout the show and still manages to keep his cool and cook really well for the most part...
    This should tell you more than anything that Marcel is no stranger to this type of treatment and make you ask yourself "why". How many people do you know that can remain so unaffected when surrounded by such strong negative emotions? He consciously encourages and even nurtures these emotions in others. I don't understand how the Marcel-hating chefs who actually have to be with him 24/7 can be criticized for their inability to hide that hatred, when so many people that never even met him feel the same way.

    Sam said he was very nervous going into the F4 challenge. If he played it safe, which is more than questionable, I would attribute that to higher expectations put on him as the front runner. For someone like Marcel to make the finals by coasting along until F4 preparing dishes that consistantly placed him in the middle of the pack is grossly unfair. The only chance he should have had to make the finals was for both Sam and Ilan to fail miserably - which they didn't - in the final challenge.

  6. #146
    Forum Assistant sweetpea's Avatar
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    Oh, believe me, I don't consider Marcel an angel. I've said it before, his social skills are obviously lacking, and he probably does get a chuckle out of the rise he gets in some people. What I am saying, however, is that the other cheftestants are grown people who have behaved like children and like bullies for the most part where Marcel is concerned. Whether or not they can justify their hatred of him because he rubs people the wrong way, the guy by no means is a monster and he hasn't done a thing that warrents their continual hate-filled focus on him. If you hate the guy, fine. Talk trash about him in your confessionals. Gossip about him in your room. Even tell him to get lost to his face. But do so with a modicum of decorum and not like a bunch of whiny losers.

    This makes me think of the first time Dr. Will played BB (the only season of BB I've watched) and how hated he was. He loved every minute. He found a way to get under everyone's skin and he manipulated and gloated and lied and maneuvered his way to the win. He talked trash about everyone in his confessionals, but he did so with a twinkle in his eye. And the watching public? Loved him. Still do. The other contestants couldn't stand him but they kept their cool, as far as I can remember, and they were more intensely together than this bunch considering they were not allowed to leave the BB house.

    I think they saw Marcel as a little guy (physically diminutive compared to the other guys) who has a big ego and who is very self-confident and isn't afraid to rattle a few chains. This bugged the crap out of them. He bugged the crap out of them and they responded like school-yard bullies.

    I don't criticize them for their inability to hide their hatred. By all means let us know how you feel. But for pity's sake enough with the ganging up, the yelling, the physical assault, the whining, etc.

    I guess we see things differently dberk. I don't blame the others for disliking Marcel and I'm sure he does things to deserve it. But they took it way too far, IMO, and for that I do indeed criticize them.

  7. #147
    Ms Ambusher dberk's Avatar
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    I believe that creative people are more sensitive to emotional triggers than those of us that aren't creative and a lower boiling point is to be expected. While I continue to think that the "hair prank" was crossing way over the line, I doubt (based on his reaction to it) that it's the worst thing that ever happened to Marcel as a result of his machinations.

    BB is in the lowest group of reality shows for many reasons, but definitely as far as basic human behavior is concerned. TC on the otherhand should be in the highest group since performance and not gameplay should win the day.

    I get the impression that the Marcel fans think that, if he hadn't been on the show, the others would have just picked on someone else. I don't believe that for a minute. Mob mentality had nothing to do with Marcel being disliked by most of the other chefs.

    I worked with a woman who was disliked by all of her co-workers and we were all accused of being the real problem. This woman accessed her Quality Control records TWICE to remove errors from her record. She forwarded her phone so much that she didn't answer even 1/3 of the number of calls the rest of us did. Customers pointblank refused to deal with her. To pad her productivity she started work early repeatedly even though she had been told it was illegal and she had to stop- REPEATEDLY. She is a bare minimum worker and does the least she can get away with. After surgery she got her doctor (a relative) to extend her time off by 2 weeks and took 2 weeks after she returned to be retrained for a job she had been doing for 20 years. When asked to give input on our evaluations, she told lies that we were forced to disprove. I could say much more, but I'm sure you get the point. Management was aware of all of these things and she was never even given a formal, written warning. We had every reason to hate this woman and mob mentality had nothing to do with it.

    Some people are able to get away with things for inexplicable reasons and I believe that Marcel is one of them. In an occupation where team work is essential, an annoying person is a liability and needs to go. I can totally understand the frustration that the other chefs went through week after week as Marcel continued to skate by while remaining an irritant.

  8. #148
    FORT Fanatic texasgal26's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetpea;2220032;
    Oh, believe me, I don't consider Marcel an angel. I've said it before, his social skills are obviously lacking, and he probably does get a chuckle out of the rise he gets in some people. What I am saying, however, is that the other cheftestants are grown people who have behaved like children and like bullies for the most part where Marcel is concerned. Whether or not they can justify their hatred of him because he rubs people the wrong way, the guy by no means is a monster and he hasn't done a thing that warrents their continual hate-filled focus on him. If you hate the guy, fine. Talk trash about him in your confessionals. Gossip about him in your room. Even tell him to get lost to his face. But do so with a modicum of decorum and not like a bunch of whiny losers.
    I totally agree with this. I read Ilan's interview about Marcel, and I have read Marcel's interview about his experience. Marcel comes off as sounding mature and manages to avoid bashing his competitors; Ilan continues to complain about Marcel's cooking style and uses the fact that Sam and Betty disliked him to justify his dislike.

    I really don't care if Marcel rubs people the wrong way. Aside from the occasional snide comment (which coming from another contestant who wasn't already stigmatized wouldn't seem snide, in my opinion), I do not see grounds for the infantile behavior of the other chefs. I cringed when Marcel made arrogant comments, but I actually had to mute the TV when Betty humiliated him in front of the other contestants, and when Elan did his "go cry in a corner" rant a few weeks later. I can't stand to see someone publicly shamed like that and it makes me despise the person doing it.

    dberk, I too have seen this sort of thing happen, both in the office and in grad school. In every case, I would look back and feel guilty and realize the person didn't deserve it. There is no way to assume that every situation like this is solely the person's fault. Mob mentality, stress, competition, jealousy, a million things could have led to everyone ganging up on him.

    And why couldn't someone, just once, have pulled Marcel aside and said, "Look, I think the way you do x, y, z is rubbing people the wrong way... you might not mean it this way..." Instead he seems repeatedly bewildered about people's outbursts.

    Anyway, sweetpea, I agree that Marcel seems annoying but the others come across much worse because of their immature whining.

  9. #149
    Read The Clue Bearcata's Avatar
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    Just an FYI.

    I have just finished watching the 1/29.07 episode of I Love New York and there is a scene were 2 of the guys held down a contestent nicknamed 'Boston' and another guy took a pair of hair clippers to 'Boston's' hair with the intention of shaving his head. Now the hair clipper got a bit of the hair but the incident stopped right there. Result. Nothing. Neither VH1 (the network broadcasting this show) nor the producers of this show did a thing. No one was kicked off for assaulting one fo the contestents. No one said much of anything on the I Love New York thread unlike here. Makes you go mmmmmmm...........
    "When life gives you lemons, squirt lemon juice in your enemy's eyes."

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