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Thread: 12/16 Survivor 25 Season Finale Show Discussion

  1. #361
    FORT Fogey
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Jexter View Post
    I'm still not convinced Denise deserved victory. I need to put some time between me and the show to think more objectively about it.

    Still, Penner had no reason to say what he did. It had nothing - absolutely nothing - to do with the game. It was petty. Lisa handled it FAR more gracefully than I ever would have.
    Ok. I just read an interview with Malcolm. He says the following:

    "Our jury knew who was winning that game. When I said “Congratulations, Denise” after I got booted, that was just the truth. Me and Denise at the final four, one of us is going to win a million dollars. They wanted it to look like Skupin and Lisa had a chance. They never had a chance. Nobody respected Skupin’s game. I still like Lisa and Skupin, I talk to them all the time. Nobody respected Skupin’s game and nobody thought Lisa was playing the game. She clearly was, but we didn’t know that. She was doing it all in interviews and confessionals. She was just this weepy Christian lady to us. So, everyone was throwing Denise softballs and I came off much angrier than I meant to. (Laughs) I wanted to make her get defensive. I wanted her to rip on Lisa a little bit. But, there was no doubt about who was winning that thing."

    Lisa WAS playing the game. Denise was coasting. IMO, of course. I guess coastig is a type of playing, just not one that I care for.
    jucamer and sparklete like this.

  2. #362
    signed, sealed, delivered maude~flanders's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by JavaJo View Post
    Dawson kissing Jeff was extremely disprespectful. The man is married!!!

    I'm surprised Lisa won fan fave. Didn't see that coming. Wish it had been Malcolm.
    Totally agree with this post!

    Overall, I liked the season until it became the Lisa Show, then I started getting sick of it. I particularly didn't care for the last episode when she just seemed to never shut the hell up! She just went on and on and on about her "journey" and her faith -all while playing a very dirty game. She didn't own it at all. She didn't gain any self-awareness in her "journey", and then she gets rewarded with winning fan favorite, which was very disappointing to me.
    Did you see the look of death that she gave Penner when he outed her? And, the way she refused to believe that Malcolm gave her the reward with her brother out of kindness instead of evil motivation? She was definitely playing the sweet card, but it was a bunch of b.s.
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  3. #363
    FORT Fogey Dragonlady's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    This season I tried really hard to like Penner...it was difficult for me because he reminded me of my ex husband sooo much. But I thought I'd concentrate on his good points: the high intellect, the brilliant way with words and his skills of strategy ...altho that can be used for positive and negative..
    I promised myself I would not pay attention to the accent of an eastern (US) Jewish man that was so similar to my Ex. And as the game went on, I found I could like him and admire him during the game. I was even rooting for him.

    And then came the Jury questions........and out came the negative parts of Penner (and the ex) by the what he did to Lisa and Denise......those were the same negative things I could no longer tolerate many many years ago.
    But I had come to a conclusion about men like Penner....and others.....they may have a way with words, backed up by extreme intelligence, and if they don't win (whatever it is they want to win) they will take delight in using those talents like a mighty sword do their best to bring down his opponents any way they can....Referring to Denice as a bitch wasn't right and outing Lisa as a famous child star made Penner feel better, hoping he caused his enemies damage.
    Just reminds me why my now caring kind DH is here watching with me instead of the Ex!
    Take your beautiful blue eyes and your brand new hair extensions (or whatever) and stay away, Penner.
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  4. #364
    Ellie May SugarMama's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    I said it before and will say it again: Mike and Lisa should have gotten rid of Malcolm or Denise and kept Abi-Maria to try to take to the F3. Both Malcolm and Denise were great in challenges and a shoe-in to win over the others, jmo.
    ilja, jucamer and Midol like this.
    To return evil for good is devilish; to return good for good is human; to return good for evil is Divine - Alistair Begg

  5. #365
    FORT Fogey Jaceegirl's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by maude~flanders View Post
    Totally agree with this post!

    Overall, I liked the season until it became the Lisa Show, then I started getting sick of it. I particularly didn't care for the last episode when she just seemed to never shut the hell up! She just went on and on and on about her "journey" and her faith -all while playing a very dirty game. She didn't own it at all. She didn't gain any self-awareness in her "journey", and then she gets rewarded with winning fan favorite, which was very disappointing to me.
    Did you see the look of death that she gave Penner when he outed her? And, the way she refused to believe that Malcolm gave her the reward with her brother out of kindness instead of evil motivation? She was definitely playing the sweet card, but it was a bunch of b.s.
    I am glad that you made this post as I felt pretty much the same way regarding Lisa. I know that is not a popular opinion here as the majority did like Lisa a lot. I don't dislike her, but I saw it as The Lisa Show as well. TC always seemed to be more about Lisa and what she was going to do. Hard to explain, but the TC's of this season were very different than what I remember of past ones. I like the Malcolm type of player and if I was on the jury I would respect his type of game. He had everyone afraid that he would win and they never were able to get him out or flush his Idol out as they have before. He was good in challenges and played a very strategic game IMO. I was very disappointed that he did not get Fan Favorite and I think many people who voted thought he would win the game and Lisa would not so possibly voted for her based on that. Maybe they were huge Facts of Life fans, which I admit I never really watched. I think it did become the Lisa show because we saw so much of her. I just don't think we saw much in regards to the other players as much as Lisa. What I really don't understand is when did this close relationship develop between Lisa, Skupin and Denise that Denise talked about when she was pleading with them to keep her over Malcolm? That was the first I heard or saw of it.

    Regarding the reward that Malcolm brought Skupin and Lisa on and Lisa referred to as Malcolm having ulterior motives for doing that. That was when he approached Skupin and Lisa for F3 and they both went along with it and it was the same deal that Malcolm trusted would being him to the F3. Instead, they went back on it and Lisa talked Skupin into choosing Denise over Malcolm. So she and Skupin broke the deal and Malcolm rewarded them with voting for Denise. Again, it was not a deal that benefited either of them in the end and it was just Lisa starting to play the game.

    I did not think Lisa would win the game at all. JMO, but I still don't see where she played this wonderful strategic game. She may have helped her tribe win challenges in the beginning, but it was not just her. Both Penner and Skupin's tribes had stronger players overall and just kept winning until they destroyed the tribe Russel had Matsing and then it became Tangdang versus Kalabaw. Denise's arguement that she had to be accepted by three tribes holds true for Malcolm as well. Difference being that Malcom was a threat, but Denise never was. Again, IMO Malcolm played a better game because he was able to hang onto his Idol.

    Once Malcolm was gone, I did think it would be between Skupin and Denise and thought maybe they would give it to Skupin just based on the fact that he won more challenges than Denise. It turned out that they were still bitter against him and obviously Lisa. I did see Lisa as kind of going along for the ride. JMO It seemed like every week she would say she was not cut out for this game and until her brother came she was not really playing the game. That was not that long before the game was over and they all went along with getting Abi out as they all voted for her. Lisa herself admitted at TC she would rather take a player like Abi over Malcolm, but she obviously did not influence anyone to vote for Abi, so what strategic move did she make other than convincing Skupin to get rid of Malcolm over Denise, but in the end Denise won anyway?

    I agree with Sugar Mama that the only way Skupin or Lisa would have won was by getting rid of Malcolm and Denise and keeping Abi for F3. Even with that who knows they may have voted for Abi. I am still confused by watching the Ponderosa clips as Penner seemed the least bitter there with the exception of RC.

    Anyway Maude, thank you as I thought I was alone in my opinion regarding Lisa and at least one other saw it the same way I did. These are all JMO.

  6. #366
    Furball Coughedupalot scoot13's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    As a jury member, I would be very angry and feel duped if I voted for Lisa, she won, and then I found out about her celebrity background. If it is not a big deal then why did you keep it from us? It is a lie by omission when she tells people that she is just a simple christian woman. She was playing everyone. Yes, that is the game but not everyone will accept being played. Someone needed to give the jury that info and Penner did it. It needed to be done.
    pikachu likes this.

  7. #367
    Live-Love-Laugh Fanny Mare's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonlady View Post
    This season I tried really hard to like Penner...it was difficult for me because he reminded me of my ex husband sooo much. But I thought I'd concentrate on his good points: the high intellect, the brilliant way with words and his skills of strategy ...altho that can be used for positive and negative..
    I promised myself I would not pay attention to the accent of an eastern (US) Jewish man that was so similar to my Ex. And as the game went on, I found I could like him and admire him during the game. I was even rooting for him.

    And then came the Jury questions........and out came the negative parts of Penner (and the ex) by the what he did to Lisa and Denise......those were the same negative things I could no longer tolerate many many years ago.
    But I had come to a conclusion about men like Penner....and others.....they may have a way with words, backed up by extreme intelligence, and if they don't win (whatever it is they want to win) they will take delight in using those talents like a mighty sword do their best to bring down his opponents any way they can....Referring to Denice as a bitch wasn't right and outing Lisa as a famous child star made Penner feel better, hoping he caused his enemies damage.
    Just reminds me why my now caring kind DH is here watching with me instead of the Ex!
    Take your beautiful blue eyes and your brand new hair extensions (or whatever) and stay away, Penner.
    I thought Lisa showed a lot of class when she said, what I did 25 years ago no more matters now than what you did 25 years ago.
    The kids on Survivor didn't even know the show she was in. Penner made himself look small and petty
    I wish Skupin and Lisa had taken Abi, because I said awhile back, I thought Denise wasn't playing a great game. jmho of course
    ilja, SugarMama and sparklete like this.
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  8. #368
    FORT Fogey jucamer's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by SugarMama View Post
    I said it before and will say it again: Mike and Lisa should have gotten rid of Malcolm or Denise and kept Abi-Maria to try to take to the F3. Both Malcolm and Denise were great in challenges and a shoe-in to win over the others, jmo.
    I agree. But I don't think I could have stood one more second watching that dreadful woman

  9. #369
    FORT Fogey jadewarlock's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by jucamer View Post
    I agree. But I don't think I could have stood one more second watching that dreadful woman
    That and I have a feeling with as nasty as the entire jury was that she'd actually pulled off a win, and with her entitled attitude and poor game play (worse than Lisa and Skupin - and I mean physical AND social) it'd be the worst win ever.

    And honestly I think even deep down inside both knew that was a huge possibility so at least if you don't win, have a winner who actually DID earn the right to be there in the spirit of the game.

    Both could've beaten Denise I think had they just not had a petty jury. It's why I respect RC and the person who voted for Mike (Jeff?)
    jucamer and sparklete like this.

  10. #370
    Ellie May SugarMama's Avatar
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    Re: 12/16/12 Season Finale Show Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by jucamer View Post
    I agree. But I don't think I could have stood one more second watching that dreadful woman
    I hear that! But she was so nasty and annoying, and she never won a challenge (well the one where she hardly had to participate). I can see a LOT of things to point out about Abi in a FTC proving it would be close to insanity to vote for her.

    But, it is what it is. And when it's all taken into account, Denise and Malcolm (whose tribe was decimated), stuck it out, stayed with one another until F4, and gave everyone a run for the money.
    Kocky_Kamikaze and jucamer like this.
    To return evil for good is devilish; to return good for good is human; to return good for evil is Divine - Alistair Begg

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