11/21/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

[AZChristian]

I think Denise (and a little bit of Lisa) telling Abi the truth was plenty. Regardless if English is her second language, Abi can pick up social cues that are universal. The fact too she kept interrupting Denise who really is trying to help her shows she knows she's not behaving properly but can't accept it.

And trying to help someone is not "brutal" - unless the person perceives it as such. But it's up to Abi if she chooses to be have this way.

That said, on the ESL bit - nope I don't buy it as an excuse. I had roommates from South Korea and Taiwan who had a weaker concept of English than Abi... BUT would know and tell me if I was acting a bit odd or ask me if I could help them with either American social cues or words they didn't understand. Will say my drawing skills improved because I had to draw at least 50 different words when the universal translator couldn't understand what I was saying. Abi I'd been demanding a room change quite honestly.

Her English was good enough that when Jeff offered her the "could the problem be a cultural/language issue?" she jumped right on it. "Yes . . . everyone else is wrong about me. I'm not a b****; I just don't understand because English is not my first language." She picked up THAT cue pretty quickly.

I'm pretty forgiving of social errors until a person hits their mid-20s. Once you've been through high school and - hopefully - some college, then gotten a job, you have no excuse for such anti-societal behavior. Abi reminds me of the woman who - at age 30, on a work-related trip - had a picture taken of herself at Arlington, next to a sign that said "Silence and Respect." She was pretending to scream while she flipped the bird. She then posted the picture on Facebook. She and her 38-year-old boss (who took the picture) joined the ranks of the unemployed as a result. She had previously posted a picture of herself lighting a cigarette next to a "No Smoking" sign.

Actions have consequences. Accept personal responsibility, and if you don't like the way things are going for you . . . CHANGE!

[judibug]

I think Abi did understand what people were telling her the other night, but she will not accept it -- perhaps because no one has ever told her before that she is pushy, arrogant, and obnoxious. We are such a polite society that we roll our eyes behind someone's back and discuss them with our friends, but never actually say to the person "You are a jerk." A few years ago I was put in charge of a young diva at the newspaper who was a horrible writer and couldn't edit to save her soul. She had been treated as a little princess by her parents and apparently got through college and two years at the newspaper without anyone ever telling her she was deficient in any way. Not realizing this, I had the gall to correct one of her stories and she hit the roof, went upstairs to the publisher and demanded that I be fired! Even after he told her it was my job to edit her and that her piece did, indeed, need editing, she refused to believe it. I'm sure she is still sailing through life thinking she is Perfection and ignoring anyone who says anything to the contrary. Abi will always be 100 percent sure that Abi is right, and nothing she hears from anyone on the show, in the press, or on websites will ever change her perception of herself.

I did think it was a shame that Denise was the only one brave enough to tell her the truth. I was hoping at some point Jeff would say "How do the rest of you feel about Abi?" to force them to give Denise some support. Plus to show Abi that ALL of them feel the same, not just Denise. Of course, they all want her jury vote.

[sunnydayz]

I really disliked Jeff offering up the excuse for Abi's nasty behavior. Not only putting it out there, but then focusing on it for most of TC. Granted, the editors show us just what they want to show us, and there were probably other things discussed at TC that we didn't get to see. However, I don't get why they spent all the time trying to rehabilitate Abi's character. It seemed a bit over the top. I just don't get it, and I don't think it will make people feel any more positive about Abi, in general. It may have just made it worse...it did for me. When they try so hard to sell an idea, I tend to become skeptical.

[Dragonlady]

She isn't young. She's 32. She is never going to develop any people skills or self-awareness.

Holy Cow! I thought she was early 20s and that's why she was so self centered and rude. I can forgive youthful unawareness a little bit but she has no reason to act that way. I refuse to give her the excuse of English being a second language. One of my degrees is in Speech Path and there is a BIG difference between "words" (as a different language) and social cues we pick up from others. She's so busy thinking about herself and talking constantly that she's oblivious to what the others are directing at her.
And shame of Jeff to give her that "easy out." To me, it goes right into that category that says don't blame me...I'm a victim.

I also agree with the other posters that are happy to see some older contestants and not always the strong and young, which I think is part of what keeps this season's episodes so interesting. It's been a slow, steady but very interesting season.

[Shoepie]

I agree with both of you. It's really a season of great stories and underdogs overcoming the odds. It just makes watching so enjoyable!
Malcolm and Denise: their tribe was decimated, they got split up, the got back together and are making a run of it. GREAT story.
Lisa: Snubbed by her tribe from the very beginning. First suggested vote out, and having a rough time of playing the game. Somehow, she prevailed.
Skupin: Accident prone, disliked by his tribe for being a doofus, but quietly playing his own game.
Penner: Has had EVERYone vote for him, has been the target numerous times, but won exactly the right immunity challenge and continues to work his way forward. I love Penner's story.

The only ones who aren't underdogs are Abi (for obvious reasons), and Carter.

I know most want Malcolm or Denise to win, but I'm actually rooting for Penner most, despite he's a returnee. Next, it would be Lisa for me, then Malcolm and Denise.

ITA. Great season and if Penner cannot win I would love to see Lisa talk it all.