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Thread: 2/23 Finale Show Discussion **Spoilers**

  1. #161
    FORT Newbie The Modernaire's Avatar
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    Whew!

    Glad to see I'm not crazy and that there are some like minded folks here:
    C-Love, Karen, Mom, CFan...It just baffled me that there were so many attacks on KS after the shoe thing, how suddenly (according to SOME people) they 'knew' she was manipulative, calculating, this, that, the other, blah blah, woof woof 'all along'...[mod edit]

    Like Courtney, I was surprised to see Jay's "Miss Fing Perfect" comment. Some friend, indeed. It's not like he had anything to worry about - unlike Wendy, he can actually DESIGN. Couldn't he just have been happy that KS was a true competitor/colleague instead of apparently wanting something bad to happen to her? I was disappointed in that. Wendy, on the other hand...man, oh man. For those out there who are big time defenders (oops! I meant, supPORTERS...) Nice displays of maturity she showed. Smirks notwithstanding, but crying at the drop of a hat (Jay - 'You KNOW she's in the elevator BAWLING right now'...cut to - hey! whaddayaknow! Bawling!) not 'considering' accessories, and - dare I say, cussing like a sailor instead of speaking like an adult...and on, and on, and on...
    It would be one thing if she was such a despicable human being who was a kick ass designer to back it up, but no. And I think she knows she was no match for the other two (Slurpin' orange scene was full of hot air, frankly).
    Case in point, when she won the Orange Feather challenge, (theme, here?) instead of looking grateful, she looked surprised, as in - 'me? are you SURE?' It's sad, really.

    Damn, I totally got off track. Ignoring Wendy was not 'jr high school'. In their unique situation of not seeing each other for almost a year, being able to watch the show only to reunite for the biggest event to date in their lives, tensions were a flyin', and rightfully so. I wouldn't give her the time of day either, and not wanting to subject myself to rude, obnoxious, dare I say - childish! reactions and disrespect, I'd avoid her too. Besides, why SHOULD KS have spoken to her? About what, exactly? Wendy made it clear she didn't give a damn about what other peoples' perceptions of her are/were, so for all of the 'soulless' back and forth banter that went on, it fell on deaf ears.

    Ok, I'm done.
    Last edited by hepcat; 02-27-2005 at 11:29 PM. Reason: No baiting, please.
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  2. #162
    Samantha's Mommy Closet Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Modernaire
    Like Courtney, I was surprised to see Jay's "Miss Fing Perfect" comment. Some friend, indeed. It's not like he had anything to worry about - unlike Wendy, he can actually DESIGN. Couldn't he just have been happy that KS was a true competitor/colleague instead of apparently wanting something bad to happen to her? I was disappointed in that.
    To be a Jay "defendy" in this case, I never took it that he *really* wanted something bad to happen to Kara Saun, and I'm sure she wouldn't have taken it that way, either. To me, that comment came from a couple of places, all of which I can perfectly understand. One, Kara Saun had gone into Fashion Week as the "annointed one", the presumptive winner, during the last challenge even Jay thought Kara Saun was a shoo-in (forgive the pun!) for the win, she'd won all those challenges, she *was* "miss perfect". This was a sign that maybe she wasn't. Two, I think he was irritated with her for not speaking to Wendy and creating all that tension, which was clearly problematic for him since he didn't want to deal with it. Three, I believe he was genuinely (and rightly so) irritated at her for exploiting her industry contacts to get all those custom made shoes for free. When Kara Saun asked him about it, he said he did have a problem about it, but his response to her face was rather tempered, he seems like the type who has a problem being as vociferous and adamant about what he thinks to your face, he seems to prefer being non-confrontational, but he is much more so when expressing his thoughts outside the presence of the person in question. So, he was venting, pure and simple, in a way he couldn't or wouldn't do directly to Kara Saun's face.

    As for other posters' characterization of Kara Saun's behavior towards Wendy being so "high school" and "juvenile", I'm not so convinced. I do believe that Kara Saun had a very real, very visceral reaction to Wendy's behavior that she saw on the show in person, and even more so when she saw the "confessional" interviews on the broadcast. That reaction was exacerbated by the fact that she, Kara Saun, had been personally fooled by Wendy. I doubt Kara Saun was in the least "threatened" by Wendy's presence in the final 3, clearly, she didn't have any respect for Wendy's supposed talent anymore than Jay did, or the other designers did, and it was clear from the judges' deliberations that in their minds, Wendy was clearly not in the same league as the other two competitors. Tim Gunn's MSNBC comments would indicate that his opinion is basically along the same lines, she's a tailor, an adaptor of purchased patterns, not a real designer. I also believe that Kara Saun was offended not only by Wendy's statements and behavior, but like Jay, Kara Saun was also very offended by Wendy's repeated statements that it was just a game, whereas Kara and Jay took the competition and the show very seriously, and Wendy's statements and presence cheapened the competition, and thereby demeaned the other competitors' talents and accomplishments.

    Sure, in the business world, you have to politely deal with people all the time whom you don't like. But Wendy isn't a business contact, an employer, a client, she isn't anyone Kara Saun will ever have to deal with again in her life, and someone who is a client or business contact probably wouldn't be making televised confessionals about their intent to befriend others and exploit that friendship, exploit their role as a mother to get people out of her way, calling other competitors yahoos who were spouting pseudo-intellectual crap, etc.

    Was ignoring her so very horrible? No. Look what happened when they actually spoke to each other, catfights left and right, can't imagine why Jay found the silent treatment so much worse than public bickering. And I don't think for a minute that Wendy was entirely blameless in the matter, either, aside from the fact that her previous statements were the major source of the underlying friction and dislike. Wendy arrived first, undoubtedly had the opportunity to scope out the suite and figure out one room had two beds, the other was a single. She herself admitted that they had not parted on the best of terms, she had no realistic basis to think that watching her statements on the show would endear her to the others, if she'd had an ounce of grace, she would have taken the single room, and Kara Saun and Jay would have had no problem bunking with each other. She had to have known her roommate would be displeased, to say the least. If people dislike you, and you have the slightest sensitivity to that, why get in their face? To provoke and upset them, of course.

    Jay wasn't pleased to see Wendy in the suite when he arrived, and had already decided to ignore her, but being someone more adverse to confrontation, decided against it. What did it get him? Wendy's snarky comments. Kara Saun was even less pleased to see Wendy, but at least gave her a half hearted wave, didn't completely ignore her, despite wanting to. I'm not sure by Wendy's smile at Kara when she came in whether she had actually deluded herself into thinking Kara Saun would be pleased to see her, or enjoy sharing a room with her, or whether she was enjoying the girl's discomforture, but once she realized Kara Saun preferred sleeping on the couch to sharing a room, she could have offered to swap with Jay, thereby resolving the problem.

    Instead, Wendy got in Kara Saun's face repeatedly, provoking her, doing it deliberately either because she couldn't stand being ignored, because she's just inherently confrontational, because she thought upsetting Kara Saun would be advantageous to her, or all of the above. Which is more immature, not speaking to someone, or deliberately trying to upset and provoke them?

  3. #163
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    "Which is more immature, not speaking to someone, or deliberately trying to upset and provoke them?"

    YES!!!

    I guess the ultimate proof will be whose designs are purchased more, and who lasts longer in the business. Which is my way of saying, "Buh-bye Wendy. Run along back to Virginia now. Your fifteen minutes are over. W-a-a-a-y over."

  4. #164
    FORT Biscuit VeronicaBelle27's Avatar
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    Okay, I finally saw the episode last night. My tape ran out during the first twenty minutes of my tape on Wednesday night. Aaargh. Anyway...

    My favorites had been Kara Saun and Austin. With Jay running right in line with Austin.

    My big beef from this episode is that Michael/Nina/Heidi/Parker said that Wendy will do "whatever someone tells her to and that's a good thing (you mean like a dressmaker????) but they want someone who follows their heart," BUT in the last elimination they said that the wonderfully talented Austin won't listen to them and follows his heart and that's why he goes home. Ugh. Stupid producer stuff. This show has enough to keep viewers interested without any of this crappy drama and keeping in people with minimal talent and the ridiculous "time-constrained, who can sew the fastest" challenges!!!!! Please let them change for season two!!!

    Another thing: on the point of "influence". These people, like everyone in the free world, do not live in a vacuum. They are influenced by the world around them. You cannot help that. Alexandra took it too far, and that's what got her eliminated. I'm fine with that, it was a direct copy, and poorly executed to boot. Kara Saun being "Gucci-esque" is not to be helped. A designer designs according to what they like and want to see, and if she likes these things of course she's going to use them. Austin is inspired by 40's and 50's glamour, haute couture, so what??? Jay's outfits were the hardest to find a moniker for. Who was he "obviously" emanating?? Not one really, truly, in your face copy. Wendy's clothes could be found in any H&M store. Period. On this alone, Jay was my chosen winner. Never mind that he would benefit most from the prizes. Go Jay!

    Kara Saun. Loved the collection, though not wearable by most people. Although the accessories always factor in to the judging, we were not too aware of that during the season..... we were only made aware of it during this episode. I praise her for using her contacts, but turn against her when it comes to thinking she could get around her contract. Though we have no idea what was "the real situation" and what was forced/edited for reality tv. Anyway, she does not NEED the mentorship.... although the 100Gs for her line would have come in handy, plenty of people want her designs now as a result of the show. Good for her!

    Jay. ABSOLUTELY loved it!!!! That coat was TO DIE For!!!!!!!

    Wendy's. As I said, can find them at H&M and wouldn't buy them. Did it seem to anyone else like she just threw a bunch of stuff together and figured out a theme after the fact. Felt bad for Melissa, she knew there was no way she was going to win, though she probably knew that already since the other two had already had their established faves. I can't help but think what might have happened if one of these things had happened: Austin had not been eliminated and/or Jay had not given Julia a second chance after the post office challenge. Poor Martinique, I loved her. Julia was one of my least favorites. Out of 12 I had her as number 11 I think.

    Congrats to Jay! All Hail the new and improved Project Runway, that's less of a typical "reality" show, and more of a documentary about people who design clothes, are filmed doing it, and are judged on their creations!!!
    Last edited by VeronicaBelle27; 02-28-2005 at 02:33 PM.
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  5. #165
    Ruben is "Soulful" pillbeam's Avatar
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    Regarding comments about the bedroom situation. The room with two beds was obviously set up for two people of the same gender. Wendy and Kara would have preferred a single room if that had been an option--who wouldn't? Jay was lucky to get the privacy during this hectic time.

    The producers are to blame for this. They could easily have afforded to set the contestants up in a place with three bedrooms, but they squeezed Wendy and Kara Saun into the same room just to ignite fireworks. It was a cynical, disgusting manipulation of personalities for ratings.

  6. #166
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    I have to agree with you Harvest

    Well I have to agree, while Wendy would have profitted from more grace in her statements about others, Jay and KS were worse by far. I do, however belive that Jay was sucked into the Wendy-bashing by KS. If you notice, everything that Wendy got blamed for, KS was in a position to do it too. Why they jumped on Wendy and not KS is a tribute to KS's manipulative nature, something I do NOT admire. I'd like a "where are they now" article in the near future. Gucci should snap KS up. LOL
    B

    QUOTE=Harvest]I agree with almost everything you said. I have posted before that Wendy was set up and Kara was a snake. In the finale episode she was revealed to be a cheating scum who is unwilling to even admit her villainy. Kara was psychotic, and although Wendy was not able to "defend" herself, she did comport herself with more grace and dignity than Kara or Jay either.

    I was losing my supportive feelings for Jay because of his extra-mean statements in the first half-hour, but he has a way of endearing himself even with all the snarking and smoking. He was my original pick to win, and by the end I was very glad he won, especially since the producer's were letting Kara basically get away with her arrogant shoe cheat. (It is like with a jury; an objection can be sustained but the comment has already made its impact. The judges already saw the shoes on the runway; how can they really "disregard" them?)

    Kara had a "strategy" of turning attention to the so-called wrongdoing of others and flying under the radar herself. How is it they didn't see that??? Just because she calls her own behavior "aggressive and acceptable" doesn't mean that it is acceptable.

    Also, Kara's clothes were just copies of things (be it Gucci or old movie outfits), not original like Jay's or wearable like Wendy's. Except there would be gaping holes in front (hated her clothes that did that all season) and back. Even Jay's finale gown had the gaping fabric hole where a chest should go. What was this, Project Tuberculosis?[/QUOTE]

  7. #167
    the simple things babymay's Avatar
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    so who did steal the dye, pattern piece, draw the line...I can't believe they didn't expose this at the reunion...
    You've got to kiss a few frogs before you find your prince!

  8. #168
    Caged Mah Jongg Solitaire Champion Maveno's Avatar
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    I totally agree! I sure wish they would have resolved/revealed those lil nuggets of knowledge with us.

    They were probably trying to stay away from the typical "reality show" antics by NOT showing.. but, comeon damn it! Some of us are hardcore reality show addicts!
    All things beautiful do not have to be full of color to be noticed; in
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  9. #169
    the simple things babymay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maveno
    I totally agree! I sure wish they would have resolved/revealed those lil nuggets of knowledge with us.

    They were probably trying to stay away from the typical "reality show" antics by NOT showing.. but, comeon damn it! Some of us are hardcore reality show addicts!
    after reading all the posts above, I think it was Kara Saun. BTW, I didn't like her collection. Why would I want to wear jodphers? I actually liked Wendys stuff. It was very Town and County.
    You've got to kiss a few frogs before you find your prince!

  10. #170
    Fight Queen corprip's Avatar
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    Wendy did it. She was the one who miraculously found the dye when Kevin was frantic looking for it. It looked like it was even near her work station.
    "I've got soul, but I'm not a soldier." The Killers.

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