Re: Sister Wives
You know, it's kind of a funny thing, whether Christians/Catholics/whoever believe that Jesus is God, whether they are two seperate beings, whatever. I've known Jewish people that believe in Jesus, just not that he was the long awaited Messiah-that he was a prophet of God who was another that preached God's word. I know that Muslims generally believe that as well.
I was raised Catholic, and the one thing that stuck with me (even though I don't consider myself Catholic anymore) is what one priest taught me, aside from anyone else. He told me once (and I think this can apply in a lot of teachings other than Catholicism. He didn't reject any kind of idea, even if it wasn't strictly canon, and always tried to find a bridge between religion and science-in other words, he encouraged his students to THINK, instead of just blindly believing Church teachings or how we were brought up) to think of the Trinity as a three sided coin. God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are three aspects of the same being. If you look at just one side, you may understand a part of the truth and be blessed for that, but you won't see the true essence of the whole coin.
I don't know so much about other Christian groups other than they generally place a greater importance of the aspect of Jesus, but there was one other lesson I took away from this priest. If you are happy, aren't hurting anyone else, and are generally trying to promote good will in the world, you are blessed by God. We may not understand the actions of this family, but that does not mean they are wrong in their choice to live a polygamous lifestyle. I wouldn't want to share my man with anyone else, but I think it's just as wrong to condemn polygamy as it is to condemn homosexuality.
*Off my soapbox box now* Sorry... I don't mean to offend anyone, but the stripping away of people's rights kinda scares me. Any friction in Kody and whichever wife's marriage is between them, I feel, and no different than any other marriage in the USA today.
Re: Sister Wives
There are many, many differences between Mormon doctrine and Christian doctrine as it relates to God (in general) and Jesus (in particular). If anyone is interersted in the differences, they are easily researched. So, I understand why Christians would say that the Mormon church is not a Christian church. The differences in their teachings are radical differences.
Originally Posted by RSTARMARGS;4092526;
Re: Sister Wives
I'm sorry if I offended anyone! I certainly didn't mean it that way. I was just letting you know, in general, how the mainstream Christian church here views Mormonism. The teachings of the Mormon church are vastly different than the teachings of the Christian church. They are absolutely different religions.
Originally Posted by barbh;4092555;
Does that mean that Christians are wrong and Mormons are right? Or that Christians are right and Mormons are wrong? Or that we are both wrong and Muslims are right? That is up to God, not me. I never meant to imply that I am the judge of it. I am just stating the fact that the Christian church does not recognize Mormonism as a Christian denomination.
Only God knows the heart of each person and the bible says that each of us will be judged (by Him) according to how much light we have received. No human can say whether or not another human is going to heaven.
Someone mentioned upthread that the Mormons believe in a heavenly mother, or co-God. That is another doctrine that is contrary to Christian doctrine. Christians believe that there is only one God, and no other. No wife, or other gods. He was , and is, and is eternal. They do not believe that God is married or that he became a God in Celestial heaven and him and his wife made our planet as their reward. Joseph Smith said that "as man is, God was. As God is, man can become." This statement makes Mormonism a seperate religion than Christianity.
I think that if we want to discuss the religious beliefs of this family, we need to keep to facts and not emotions. Religion is a "hot button" and this thread will just get shut down.
From my own personal Christian viewpoint, there are many comments here that could offend me, but I respect the rights of each person to hold their own belief system without it affecting my own. I think that speaking factually about religious beliefs is the only way to navigate the landmines of religious offenses, and that we all need to be tolerant and understanding of our differences.
So, please forgive me if I've offended anyone. I certainly didn't mean it that way!:hrtbeat
Re: Sister Wives
I think we need to be careful of how we address religion here. People have very deep feelings about their beliefs. The show purposefully does not go into religious beliefs and I don't believe it's even been revealed what religion they do belong to, although I may have missed it. We know they don't belong to the Mormon church or any mainstream religion as none of those condone polygamy.
Wanting to understand other religions is a good thing, but we sometimes post without much thought of how it might come across and without consideration of others deeply held beliefs. Sometimes things get posted that are inaccurate because someone thinks they "know" about a certain religion or things get said that are hurtful without intending to be, so let's just take extra pains to be thoughtful, factual and open minded.
Re: Sister Wives
I agree. We really should be sticking to discussing the show.
Re: Sister Wives
This is somehing my son, John, sent to me 8 years ago. I saved it because it spoke deeply to me, and I share it now because I think it's worthy of sharing:
To: My Children on Earth
RE: Idiotic Religious Rivalries
My Dear Children (and believe me, that's all of you), I consider myself a pretty patient guy. I mean, look at the Grand Canyon. It
took millions of years to get it right. And about evolution? Boy, nothing is slower than designing that whole Darwinian thing to take
place, cell by cell, and gene by gene.
I've been patient through your fashions, civilizations, wars and schemes, and the countless ways you take Me for granted until you get
yourselves into big trouble again and again.
I want to let you know about some of the things that are starting to tick me off.
First of all, your religious rivalries are driving Me up a wall. Enough already! Let's get one thing straight. These are YOUR
religions, not Mine. I'm the whole enchilada; I'm beyond them all. Every one of your religions claims there is only one of Me (which by the way, is
But in the very next breath, each religion claims it's My favorite one. And each claims its bible was written personally by Me, and that
all the other bibles are man-made. Oh, Me. How do even I begin to put a stop to such complicated nonsense?
Okay, listen up now. I'm your Father AND Mother, and I don't play favorites among My children. Also, I hate to break it to you, but I
don't write. My longhand is awful, and I've always been more of a "doer" anyway. So ALL of your books, including those bibles, were
written by men and women. They were inspired, remarkable people, but hey also made mistakes here and there. I made sure of that, so that
you would never trust a written word more than your own living heart.
You see, one human being to me — even a bum on the street — is worth more than all the Holy Books in the world. That's just the kind of guy I
am. My Spirit is not a historical thing, it's alive right here, right now, as fresh as your next breath.
Holy books and religious rites are sacred and powerful, but not more so than the least of you. They were only meant to steer you in the
right direction, not to keep you arguing with each other, and certainly not to keep you from trusting your own personal connection
Which brings Me to My next point about your nonsense. You act like I need you and your religions to stick up for Me or "win souls" for My
sake. Please, don't do Me any favors. I can stand quite well on my own, thank you. I don't need you to defend Me, and I don't need
constant credit. I just want you to be good to each other.
And another thing: I don't get all worked up over money or politics, so stop dragging My name into your dramas. For example, I swear to Me
that I never threatened Oral Roberts. I never rode in any of Rajneesh's Rolls Royces. I never told Pat Robertson to run for
president, and I've never EVER had a conversation with Jim Baker, Jerry Falwell, or Jimmy Swaggart! Of course, come Judgement Day, I
certainly intend to...
The thing is, I want you to stop thinking of religion as some sort of loyalty pledge to Me. The true purpose of your religions is so that
YOU can become more aware of ME, not the other way around. Believe Me, I know you already. I know what's in each of your hearts, and I
love you with no strings attached. Lighten up and enjoy Me. That's what religion is best for.
What you seem to forget is how mysterious I am. You look at the petty differences in your Scriptures and say, "Well, if THIS is the truth,
then THAT can't be!" But instead of trying to figure out My Paradoxes and Unfathomable Nature — which by the way, you NEVER will — why not open
your hearts to the simple common threads in all religions.
You know what I'm talking about: Love and respect everyone. Be kind, even when life is scary or confusing, take courage and be of good
cheer, for I am always with you. Learn how to be quiet, so you can hear My still, small voice (I don't like to shout) Leave the world a
better place by living your life with dignity and gracefulness, for you are My Own Child. Hold back nothing from life, for the parts of
you that can die surely will, and the parts that can't, won't. So don't worry, be happy (I stole that last line from Bobby McFerrin, but
who do you think gave it to him in the first place?)
Simple stuff. Why do you keep making it so complicated? It's like you're always looking for an excuse to be upset. And I'm very tired
of being your main excuse. Do you think I care whether you call me Yahweh, Jehovah, Allah, Wakantonka, Brahma, Father, Mother or even the
Void of Nirvana? Do you think I care which of My special children you feel closest to - Jesus, Mary, Buddha, Krishna, Mohammed or any of the
others? You can call Me and My Special Ones any name you choose, if only you would go about My business of loving one another as I love
you. How can you keep neglecting something so simple?
I'm not telling you to abandon your religions. Enjoy your religions, honor them, learn from them, just as you should enjoy, honor, and
learn from your parents. But do you walk around telling everyone that your parents are better than theirs? Your religion, like your
parents, may always have the most special place in your heart; I don't mind that at all. And I don't want you to combine all the Great
Traditions in One Big Mess. Each religion is unique for a reason. Each has a unique style so that people can find the best path for
But My Special Children - the ones that your religions revolve around - all live in the same place (My heart) and they get along perfectly,
I assure you. The clergy must stop creating a myth of sibling rivalry where there is none.
My blessed children of Earth, the world has grown too small for your pervasive religious bigotries and confusion. The whole planet is
connected by air travel, satellite dishes, telephones,the Internet, fax machines, rock concerts, diseases, and mutual needs and concerns. Get with the
program! If you really want to help then commit yourselves to figuring out how to feed your hungry, clothe your naked, protect your
abused, and shelter your poor.
And just as importantly, make your own everyday life a shining example of kindness and good humor. I've given you all the resources you
need, if only you abandon your fear of each other and begin living, loving, and laughing together.
Finally, My Children everywhere, when you think of the life of Jesus and the fearlessness with which He chose to live and die, remember this: As I love
Him, so do I love each one of you. I'm not really ticked off, I just wanted to grab your attention because I hate to see you suffer.
But I gave you free will. I just want you to be happy.
Trust in Me.
Your One and Only,
Re: Sister Wives
excellent post..I also agree...I am one of those people that believe that if you are a grown consenting adult what you do in your bedroom and who you do it with his your business I can deal with their choice in this lifestyle..they aren't living in a cult type atmosphere that tosses out the boys and girls are placed in a marriage book and are forced to be a 10th wife to a much older man when they are just teenagers....at least these people have stated they don't want their children to blindly marry someone before getting an education..and as wife #2 stated god forbid that someone else chooses whom they marry..and they said they wanted the children to marry for love whether or not they choose a polygamus lifestyle and as we heard one of the girls has stated quite clearly she will NOT share a man and that seems to be fine with her family...I think that no matter what type of lifestyle these children choose that the family will still love them and support them...but this is the way I feel wether it be polygamy, homosexuality, or even for a woman that chooses to have an abortion...these are choices I personally would NOT make for myself...but if you are a grown consenting adult what you do in or out of the bedroom and whom you do it with is your business and not mine...as long as you don't try to push your beliefs on me I won't push mine on you..these people have the right to live their lives in a manner that they want to live it....ohhhhhhhhhh its time for the GREAT PUMPKIN CHARLIE BROWN....lol.....just isn't Halloween without this show...lol
Originally Posted by pretlitdev;4092572;
Re: Sister Wives
I haven't watched the show but the comments are fascinating. I do agree, though, that perhaps we should leave religion out of it and just stick to the show. Is there a thread here on FORT about comparative religions? Perhaps it would be a good idea to start one. I do think it's a fascinating topic, worthy of rational discussion.
Re: Sister Wives
i think it would also be a fascinating topic...maybe we need to ask one of the mods if we could start a link and where they would let us put it...but the big problem I see is that there are 2 things people usually feel very strongly and are passionate about and those are religion and politics and usually having an open discussion on either of these subjects usually causes arguments and fights because no matter what you believe someone else will feel different about it
Originally Posted by Eastcoastmom;4093058;
Re: Sister Wives
Well, that's certainly true. I do post, however, on another message board, more of a fan forum for a musician, and we do have both religion and politics threads, where we have quite lively discussions. It can be done. Guess it's up to the mods to decide.
Originally Posted by ButterflyFaery;4093066;
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