The View

Its the WAY Elisabeth comes across..that annoys some people. She butts in, just as she was trying to do in that particular conversation, and almost always makes whatever issue is discussed very combative. She gets red-faced and very combative/defensive. They may have been on 'the same page' with their thoughts and views, but it's the WAY Elisabeth gets hers across that is so annoying.

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Originally Posted by angelic_one2002;3136594;

Its the WAY Elisabeth comes across..that annoys some people. She butts in, just as she was trying to do in that particular conversation, and almost always makes whatever issue is discussed very combative. She gets red-faced and very combative/defensive. They may have been on 'the same page' with their thoughts and views, but it's the WAY Elisabeth gets hers across that is so annoying.

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I understand that. But I've never understood why Elisbeth is singled out for that behavior. There is not a woman on that show who is not guilty of the same behavior. Each of them has issues they are extremely passionate about, and get very emotional. Each of them can be rather close-minded about some issues. Each of them butts in, talks over the others, and can be more focused on what they want to say than they are on listening to the others. In the conversation yesterday, as with most days, Elisabeth talked over Whoopi, AND Whoopi talked over Elisabeth. It is the way the show functions. I can totally understand why some people don't like it and get annoyed by it. But I've never quite understoond why Elisabeth is lambasted for it, and the others go unnoticed.

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Originally Posted by angelic_one2002;3136594;

Its the WAY Elisabeth comes across..that annoys some people. She butts in, just as she was trying to do in that particular conversation, and almost always makes whatever issue is discussed very combative. She gets red-faced and very combative/defensive. They may have been on 'the same page' with their thoughts and views, but it's the WAY Elisabeth gets hers across that is so annoying.

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and she speaks OVER :soapbox everyone else, as though her opinions are more important than anyone else's. I just HATE that! Someone should really inform her that she is not the only person on the panel :ohno I don't want to hear her opinion on every.single.topic. I wish Joy would speak up a bit more. And although Sherri has some dim moments - she doesn't have the "superior" attitude that Elisabeth has.

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I understand that. But I've never understood why Elisbeth is singled out for that behavior. There is not a woman on that show who is not guilty of the same behavior. Each of them has issues they are extremely passionate about, and get very emotional. Each of them can be rather close-minded about some issues. Each of them butts in, talks over the others, and can be more focused on what they want to say than they are on listening to the others. In the conversation yesterday, as with most days, Elisabeth talked over Whoopi, AND Whoopi talked over Elisabeth. It is the way the show functions. I can totally understand why some people don't like it and get annoyed by it. But I've never quite understoond why Elisabeth is lambasted for it, and the others go unnoticed.

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I agree that all of them are guilty of it at times. However, Elisabeth seems to do it more often, and always continues to speak over someone else until the other person just gives up on their thought completely.

They do all talk over each other, but I tend to feel that the others do with more intellect. The others also don't take it to such a personal level like I feel Elisabeth does. (ie: the tears, red face..etc) Just my opinion.

Elisabeth is far from stupid. She is outnumbered 4 to 1 on that paticular panel so she is often on the heavy defense and her delivery is too often shrill and very passionate. I think she deserves a lot of credit for her thoughts yesterday. Whoopi's example of her mother not being able to vote was sad to me. Not to long before that women were unable to vote as well. In this world we all have to deal with discrimination obvious, reverse, age, race, religion, gender. MOVE ON already. Quit whining and complaining and being a victim of the past and IF the black race wants to use the N word FINE, however, DO NOT be surprised or complain when others use it.

If others do use it take the time to just try and see how it was meant. The worst part is that even the black community can't agree on whether the word should be used so DON'T go off on the rest of the world when we are confused or question the use. And Whoopi I am sorry we do live in the same world everyone has experienced some type of discrimination.

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Originally Posted by Bandy;3136644;

And Whoopi I am sorry we do live in the same world everyone has experienced some type of discrimination.

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I am a woman, and a middle-aged fat woman at that, so yes, I have experienced discrimination. However, I am white and I know, I have seen and heard with my own eyes and ears, that discrimination against blacks is far, far worse than anything I've ever experienced. I've seen a well-dressed (Armani) young co-worker blatantly followed through a department store while looking for a gift for his girlfriend, I've had a supervisor actually tell me not to put an applicant through because "those people are lazy", I've read many, many stories in the paper about black people being stopped because their car was nice enough for a white person, and I've seen countless people scuttle across the street because a well-dressed, middle-aged black person was walking their way. There aren't many of us who've experienced discrimination of that nature.

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Originally Posted by Rattus;3136664;

I am a woman, and a middle-aged fat woman at that, so yes, I have experienced discrimination. However, I am white and I know, I have seen and heard with my own eyes and ears, that discrimination against blacks is far, far worse than anything I've ever experienced. I've seen a well-dressed (Armani) young co-worker blatantly followed through a department store while looking for a gift for his girlfriend, I've had a supervisor actually tell me not to put an applicant through because "those people are lazy", I've read many, many stories in the paper about black people being stopped because their car was nice enough for a white person, and I've seen countless people scuttle across the street because a well-dressed, middle-aged black person was walking their way. There aren't many of us who've experienced discrimination of that nature.

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Which leads to the point that Whoopi was making about how we move forward from there.

Well, it is definately not going to happen by looking backward all the time. Make an effort keep pushing and with people like Elisabeth no matter how annoying who feel for exampl the N word is objectionable at all times maybe that will help. Double standards never work. I think the Jewish race could complain about quite a bit of opression and discrimination. NO not everyone has felt it at the same level as some black people but not all black people have/are vicitims either.

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Originally Posted by Veruka;3136583;

Listening to the words that both Elisabeth and Whoopi were using yesterday, they were both essentially saying the same thing, so I'm not sure the Elisabeth should be classified as being wrong, or as being intolerant of not having her way. After all, they were both stating opinions, so neither was right or wrong.

The crux of Elisabeth's argument was that the hurt and power behind the n-word is something that no human should inflict on another, and that everytime it is repeated with good intention (the "take control back" usage in the black community) it has the unintended consequence of continuining and perpetuating its use for negative means. (Right or wrong, bigots justify their use of it saying "Well they use it, so its okay"). She was arguing that we need to get past it, by not using it at all.

When Whoopi responded to her, the point she was making was not "We're here, we're using it, get used to it". Rather, it was that she agrees that we need to get past it, that we need to move beyond the hurt, and that we need to find a way to do that.

So the two were truly on the same page much much more than they were in disagreement.

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Sorry to say but Whoopi was right. Using the "N" word by non blacks, you have to be very careful (I never use that word in public or private). People get offended, it's just more acceptable for blacks to use the word. Many things have improved for blacks but it's a slow process, maybe in another lifetime, another world things will be much better.

I'm sorry but it has all improved. There is definately discrimination mentality and actions still alive but there are no laws that discriminate in fact there are laws to protect from it. I agree with E that the word shouldn't be used period. EVER. Will all races live in harmony in a perfect world? NO it will never happen. There will always be gender, age, race, religious etc discrimination. Always, as we live in a crazy broken world. All we can do is all we can in our immediate communities and police ourselves in our own speech, actions and attitudes. Payback for past offenses to any race or gender will never happen.