The View - Page 103

Veruka · 12-13-2006, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScoutMom

It just seems to be that in today's society, people don't want to take any responsibility for anything. I don't care what the issue is - if you've inadvertently said/done something that is hurtful to another person/group, then 'fess up! Apologize. I'm sick and tired of hearing all the excuses about why someone did/said something - they were abused, neglected, teased, ad nauseum. Stand up and take responsibility. Say you were wrong and that you're sorry. Nobody is perfect; we all make mistakes. (I think I'm finished ranting now.)

I also agree with this 100%. But I'll add, I think it can be applied to both sides of this "controversy". (I put that in quotes, because I have observed that beyond viewers of a few entertainment shows, it doesn't appear to be much of a controversy) Not only do people not want to take responsibilty for anything, but they want to be treated gently and with care 100% of the time. Too many people will take anything that goes against their way of thinking - a word or phrase, a way of thinking that differs from theirs, whatever - as a direct attack on them. They'll justify their response with explanations of being abused, neglected, teased, etc. People are going to do, say, and think things that you don't agree with. That's not always an attack on you, and does not need to be treated that way in each instance.

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Lois Lane · 12-13-2006, 05:16 PM

I don't watch this show enough to know, but has anyone noticed less tolerance from the panel with its minority members gone? (I'm talking about Lisa Ling and Star Jones). I kind of liked the idea of having women of different ages and ethnic backgrounds on the show to give it a different point of view. But perhaps it's the same as it's always been?

PWS · 12-13-2006, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScoutMom

It just seems to be that in today's society, people don't want to take any responsibility for anything. I don't care what the issue is - if you've inadvertently said/done something that is hurtful to another person/group, then 'fess up! Apologize. I'm sick and tired of hearing all the excuses about why someone did/said something - they were abused, neglected, teased, ad nauseum. Stand up and take responsibility. Say you were wrong and that you're sorry. Nobody is perfect; we all make mistakes. (I think I'm finished ranting now.)

Right, just say you didn't know and apologize. I once used the phrase "Indian summer" and a Native American friend told me that it was a phrase that was really offensive to Native Americans (the whole "unreliable" aspect of the derivation). Once I'd heard that, it was one of those "duh" experiences, and I've tried not to use it again. Similarly "welshing on a bet", "gypping someone", etc.
Nobody's supposed to be perfect; we are expected to learn from our mistakes. And a "role model" like Rosie, who does expect others to learn from theirs, should be setting a good example.

Lois Lane · 12-13-2006, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PWS

Right, just say you didn't know and apologize. I once used the phrase "Indian summer" and a Native American friend told me that it was a phrase that was really offensive to Native Americans (the whole "unreliable" aspect of the derivation). Once I'd heard that, it was one of those "duh" experiences, and I've tried not to use it again. Similarly "welshing on a bet", "gypping someone", etc.

I am so glad you mentioned this. I didn't know any of this. Now I do!

And duh, I thought it was "welching out" like in Welch's grape juice!

Not that that makes any sense...but then neither do I, usually!

rt1ky · 12-13-2006, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScoutMom

It just seems to be that in today's society, people don't want to take any responsibility for anything. I don't care what the issue is - if you've inadvertently said/done something that is hurtful to another person/group, then 'fess up! Apologize. I'm sick and tired of hearing all the excuses about why someone did/said something - they were abused, neglected, teased, ad nauseum. Stand up and take responsibility. Say you were wrong and that you're sorry. Nobody is perfect; we all make mistakes. (I think I'm finished ranting now.)

Double

Americans are forgiving, especially of celebrities.

As much trouble as Rosie ws willing to give Kelly Ripa, Rosie should at least apologize for a misunderstanding.

candor · 12-13-2006, 09:57 PM

Wow, Indian summer is offensive? I did not know that.

Back to Rosie, it could be argued that she is a minority, since she's gay. But still, I wish we could, as a culture, just lighten up. My biggest problem with political correctness -- at least the extremes to which it's been taken -- is that it doesn't recognize intent, which is one of the most important aspects of communication.

Someone who's making fun of a minority, who's being mean-spirited and bigoted deserves to be scolded because the intent was to hurt. Someone who's perhaps insensitive but ultimately well-meaning might be gently corrected, but shouldn't suffer the same social penalty as the first offender.

And someone who's just joking ... well, let them just joke.

barefootdyke · 12-13-2006, 10:51 PM

today's show was pretty funny ... loved seeing bette midler on there. and i guess rosie, elisabeth, and joy were in the cash cab!!! it's supposed to air tomorrow ... so check your listings!!

PWS · 12-14-2006, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candor

Wow, Indian summer is offensive? I did not know that.

.

Ditto "Indian giver" for the same reason. That's more obvious I think tho...like "Jewing someone down"... pretty obvious you would offend people with that.
Lois_Lane--I think a lot of people think it's spelled welch...I see it in my students' writing that way a lot. I'm half Welsh though, so I was always aware of that one. My kids' "traditional nursery rhymes" book has one that begins
Taffy was a Welshman,
Taffy was a thief,
Taffy came to my house,
and stole a side of beef

and goes on from there with all the criminal things Taffy does (Taffy is supposed to be a Welsh version of David or Davey)--an ethnically typed name. Of course only the Brits still know this...in the States if I ask my class what country a Welshman comes from they have NO clue. If it weren't for Diana, Princess of Wales, they'd never have heard the word... and I bet half of them think she was the Princess of Whales. Or Wails.
But back to Rosie, and other celebs, still think they should take the live and learn way out of these little faux-pas.

Broadway · 12-14-2006, 11:30 AM

Considering the definition of Indian Summer is

A period of mild weather occurring in late autumn.
A pleasant, tranquil, or flourishing period occurring near the end of something: the Indian summer of the administration.

.... people are hard-pressed to make that into a negative thing. I've never ever heard people relate that to a negative stereotype such as "indecisive."

Indian giver is another story, however. That one I can certainly understand.

prhoshay · 12-14-2006, 01:09 PM

That makes me want to know who coined the phrase "Indian Summer", and what was their intent.

Today, on the show, Rosie did address the Asian reference. She apologized, saying that she truly didn't know it was offensive. 2 Asian women in the audience said that they thought it was funny, while someone else related a story about a childhood school friend of hers thought it was offensive, having been teased (to tears) with "ching-chong" on the schoolyard. Rosie seemed to be taking the live and learn approach.

Personally, I've never heard the term.

12-14-2006, 11:30 AM	#1029
Broadway One in every crowd.. Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Michigan Posts: 18,485	Considering the definition of Indian Summer is A period of mild weather occurring in late autumn. A pleasant, tranquil, or flourishing period occurring near the end of something: the Indian summer of the administration. .... people are hard-pressed to make that into a negative thing. I've never ever heard people relate that to a negative stereotype such as "indecisive." Indian giver is another story, however. That one I can certainly understand. __________________ My body is like a rum chocolate souffle. If I don't warm it up right, it doesn't rise.

12-14-2006, 01:09 PM	#1030
prhoshay Signed, Sealed, Delivered Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Right Here, Right Now Posts: 13,799	That makes me want to know who coined the phrase "Indian Summer", and what was their intent. Today, on the show, Rosie did address the Asian reference. She apologized, saying that she truly didn't know it was offensive. 2 Asian women in the audience said that they thought it was funny, while someone else related a story about a childhood school friend of hers thought it was offensive, having been teased (to tears) with "ching-chong" on the schoolyard. Rosie seemed to be taking the live and learn approach. Personally, I've never heard the term. __________________ "...each affects the other, and the other affects the next, and the world is full of stories, but the stories are all one." - Mitch Albom, one helluva writer You are the only person responsible for your happiness.

12-13-2006, 05:16 PM	#1022
Lois Lane On a cupcake mission! Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Right behind you Posts: 5,063	I don't watch this show enough to know, but has anyone noticed less tolerance from the panel with its minority members gone? (I'm talking about Lisa Ling and Star Jones). I kind of liked the idea of having women of different ages and ethnic backgrounds on the show to give it a different point of view. But perhaps it's the same as it's always been?

12-13-2006, 09:57 PM	#1026
candor FORT Fogey Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The rose city Posts: 2,160	Wow, Indian summer is offensive? I did not know that. Back to Rosie, it could be argued that she is a minority, since she's gay. But still, I wish we could, as a culture, just lighten up. My biggest problem with political correctness -- at least the extremes to which it's been taken -- is that it doesn't recognize intent, which is one of the most important aspects of communication. Someone who's making fun of a minority, who's being mean-spirited and bigoted deserves to be scolded because the intent was to hurt. Someone who's perhaps insensitive but ultimately well-meaning might be gently corrected, but shouldn't suffer the same social penalty as the first offender. And someone who's just joking ... well, let them just joke.

12-13-2006, 10:51 PM	#1027
barefootdyke shoes? who needs shoes?? Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: michigan Age: 46 Posts: 6,679	today's show was pretty funny ... loved seeing bette midler on there. and i guess rosie, elisabeth, and joy were in the cash cab!!! it's supposed to air tomorrow ... so check your listings!!