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Thread: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

  1. #11
    Pineapple! ClosetRTWatcher's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by shoepie;3278074;
    Ester doesn't strike you as a racist? Well, she is. It is very clear.
    I thought Esther made her racism very clear in the first episode. Since then she hasn't been as blatant about it as Mrs. B has, but I do believe it has been there the whole time.

  2. #12
    FORT Fogey Beachmom's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    Race vs. religion - I once asked someone I taught with if he was Jewish (it didn't come out of the blue; we knew each other well and had been talking about it). He was Jewish by nationality and proud of it, but he was a Christian.

    I think Esther is concerned about the religion part of it. I know a lot of you will disagree with me. I have a lot of friends who are in interfaith marriages. Some work well, some are unbelievably hard because the parents won't accept the spouse. I also know some Jewish moms well. Their hope is that their children will marry inside the faith. To me, this is not racist. There are people of every color who are Jewish (faith).

    I hope someday with my own children I will be tolerant. I look at these moms now and laugh, but a tiny piece of me says, "what would I do?" I will try to accept. The love and respect of my children means more to me than marrying outside of their faith or race. As long as that person is kind and considerate - and respectful to dh and me of course - and loves my child to no end, I will be happy! OH - just one tiny thing - no Playboy bimbos for my ds allowed!

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    FORT Fogey Harvest's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by Beachmom;3278645;
    OH - just one tiny thing - no Playboy bimbos for my ds allowed!
    I think that is the mothers' problem -- they don't seem to realize they are not in the position to allow or not allow.
    I think the firefighter's mother should stop focusing on the bimbos and just accept that her son is kind of dumb and shallow. The med student who likes him strikes me as very shallow and acts obnoxiously entitled. I think I'd prefer the Penthouse girl - at least she doesn't seem a stupid as the blonde or as self-centered as the med student.

    As for Esther, I did feel that JoJo's mother was much more unlikeable than Esther, and it did occur to me that for that reason Esther gets away with some of the same bigotry that Mrs. B. gets slammed for. However, because I do like Esther, when she expresses her views my reaction is more to respect her integrity even though I can see her prejudices cause damage to her ability to have relationships with those who do not fit into her scheme of things.

  4. #14
    addicted MamaC's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    Isn't it also that if a Jewish guy marries a non-Jew, the children of that union are not considered Jewish?

    One of my friends growing up had a Jewish father and Christian mom. The Jewish side of the family basically disowned them because they did not consider the daughter to be Jewish...because the mother wasn't.

    I can see Esther having a problem with the non-Jewish status of a potential DIL, based on the fact that members of her family died during the Holocaust. To her, it means so much that they keep the Jewish faith going strong forever.

    However, the likelihood that any of these guys actually ends up with any of these women is slim to none. So she should just relax and enjoy her little trip to the Caribbean. I would bet the when the time comes, Rob will end up marrying a nice Jewish girl.

    (And it won't be Lauren....I see absolutely no chemistry there!)

  5. #15
    Total Gleek BuckeyeGal007's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    I think Rob will pick Camilla and they might even date for a while, but I think he'll end up marrying a girls of the Jewish faith because that is obviously important to him and his family...and I agree, that Jewish girl will not be Lauren.

    I think Jojo will surprise people and pick Mindy over his mom. I don't think he's as much on his momma's apron strings as the other two. I think he really likes Mindy and wants to see if it'll work out.

    I think Michael will pick Amanda, but that relationship is probably already over. He likes the blonde bombshells and his mom needs to just accept that that is probably who he's going to end up with. He seems incredibly vain to me. If you notice, when he's on the dates with the blondes (Michelle, Megan) all they do is make out. When he's on the dates with the others (Amanda, Erica), he is actually having fun and having conversations, not just making out.
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    FORT Fogey Miss_Griss's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    OK. I haven't been watching the show, but I just went to the NBC site and watched the "Nice Guys Exist" video with Camilla and Robb. Did his mother really say, "She's too tall for you?" LOL

    It's not funny that she's racist. That's sad. But I've never "tall" used as code word for "black" when referring to a woman.
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  7. #17
    Let the Game Begin proudnewf's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    This show is a hoot to watch. The scripting is even more evident than other "reality" shows. It's just pure entertainment value as I don't see any of the "relationships" being formed are anything more than scripting with minor input from the boys & their mommas.

    Michael is just in it for the fun as evidenced by his women choices and their make out sessions - he's not ready to settle down yet by a long stretch, so momma can continue to push him toward her choices for him but he will continue with the well built easy make out women until he is ready to settle into a commitment at which time he will probably heed some of momma's advice. Oh, I might mention that Erica as well as being a Penthouse model is also an actress. Producers have kept her in for that reason and she is playing the part of "oh dear I have a secret and what am I going to do when it becomes known" role. Are there any casting people out there looking for an actress just watch her auditon over the past few weeks, because if she is serious about finding a relationship I also have a bridge to sell. Whether momma is aware of all this and playing along for the producers, who knows. It won't really make any difference who he chooses at the end of this show, it will just depend which way the wind is blowing that day.

    Rob seems like a nice young man but again is not ready to settle as he appears to be just starting to make a stand for what he wants in a relationship, so dependent upon how strongly he feels about Camilla he may use this as his show of independence knowing that in the end for the long term she will not be his wife material. The only other proviso for this could be if the producers want to continue to showcase Lauren Potter as she is an actress, then they will have Rob choose her under the guise of being obedient to his momma's choice.

    JoJo - well the producers have had a field day fueling his momma's predudices and her inability to cut the apron strings she has wrapped tightly around JoJo. But I guess if they are still footing the bill for his eduction (he still is in college and sounds like on a hockey scholarship) then she can pull those strings as tightly as she wants. It sure has been entertaining watching her mood swings from apparent dislike to inviting the eliminated african american ladies to come and visit her. Hilarious! The producers have played this really well showing JoJo as having a very kind heart, which I believe he does have, vs. his racist momma. Whether he chooses Mindy will be interesting as he has not stood up to his momma in some of his choices. I believe when he is really ready to settle into a lasting relationship he will stand up to her if need be, but the prospective one will need the patience of Job to withstand momma especially if momma does not approve. To make a nice ending to this show, I think the producers may convince momma to play along and let JoJo choose Mindy knowing that the long distance relationship will not last anyway. Hello, do we really believe it was not scripted in that momma would not choose anyone to go to the islands with them and then at the last minute have JoJo choose between her and Mindy? It's all about creating drama and momma is eager to play along while at the same time getting her precious JoJo some face time exposure - remember he is on a hockey scholarship, are we thinking major leagues in the future???
    Last edited by proudnewf; 01-15-2009 at 03:10 PM. Reason: Forgot to add some other thoughts

  8. #18
    FORT Fogey Beachmom's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by proudnewf;3279131;
    This show is a hoot to watch. The scripting is even more evident than other "reality" shows. It's just pure entertainment value as I don't see any of the "relationships" being formed are anything more than scripting with minor input from the boys & their mommas.

    Michael is just in it for the fun as evidenced by his women choices and their make out sessions - he's not ready to settle down yet by a long stretch, so momma can continue to push him toward her choices for him but he will continue with the well built easy make out women until he is ready to settle into a commitment at which time he will probably heed some of momma's advice. Oh, I might mention that Erica as well as being a Penthouse model is also an actress. Producers have kept her in for that reason and she is playing the part of "oh dear I have a secret and what am I going to do when it becomes known" role. Are there any casting people out there looking for an actress just watch her auditon over the past few weeks, because if she is serious about finding a relationship I also have a bridge to sell. Whether momma is aware of all this and playing along for the producers, who knows. It won't really make any difference who he chooses at the end of this show, it will just depend which way the wind is blowing that day.
    Interesting insight here. I don't think Erica is a very good actress, do you? I wondered about Lorraine's being "in" on the "secret." Good call!

    Rob seems like a nice young man but again is not ready to settle as he appears to be just starting to make a stand for what he wants in a relationship, so dependent upon how strongly he feels about Camilla he may use this as his show of independence knowing that in the end for the long term she will not be his wife material. The only other proviso for this could be if the producers want to continue to showcase Lauren Potter as she is an actress, then they will have Rob choose her under the guise of being obedient to his momma's choice.
    Again, good call. I think Rob will choose Camilla - like you said "show of independence."


    JoJo - well the producers have had a field day fueling his momma's predudices and her inability to cut the apron strings she has wrapped tightly around JoJo. But I guess if they are still footing the bill for his eduction (he still is in college and sounds like on a hockey scholarship) then she can pull those strings as tightly as she wants. It sure has been entertaining watching her mood swings from apparent dislike to inviting the eliminated african american ladies to come and visit her. Hilarious! The producers have played this really well showing JoJo as having a very kind heart, which I believe he does have, vs. his racist momma. Whether he chooses Mindy will be interesting as he has not stood up to his momma in some of his choices. I believe when he is really ready to settle into a lasting relationship he will stand up to her if need be, but the prospective one will need the patience of Job to withstand momma especially if momma does not approve. To make a nice ending to this show, I think the producers may convince momma to play along and let JoJo choose Mindy knowing that the long distance relationship will not last anyway. Hello, do we really believe it was not scripted in that momma would not choose anyone to go to the islands with them and then at the last minute have JoJo choose between her and Mindy? It's all about creating drama and momma is eager to play along while at the same time getting her precious JoJo some face time exposure - remember he is on a hockey scholarship, are we thinking major leagues in the future???
    This one is the most interesting to me. I believe JoJo and Mindy really do have feelings for each other, and to me, they seem to be well-matched. They live a long distance from each other though, and are so young, but stranger things have happened. I DO NOT believe Mrs. B. is exactly like she is portrayed on the show. I wonder if she made a comment jokingly with the audition and the producers ran with it. I'm not saying she doesn't want a certain type for JoJo, but I think she's a lot more tolerant than we are led to believe!

    When, oh when, will I learn that reality shows are not "real"???
    Last edited by Beachmom; 01-15-2009 at 03:56 PM.

  9. #19
    FORT Fogey Harvest's Avatar
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    Re: 1/12 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by MamaC;3278790;
    Isn't it also that if a Jewish guy marries a non-Jew, the children of that union are not considered Jewish?

    One of my friends growing up had a Jewish father and Christian mom. The Jewish side of the family basically disowned them because they did not consider the daughter to be Jewish...because the mother wasn't.

    I can see Esther having a problem with the non-Jewish status of a potential DIL, based on the fact that members of her family died during the Holocaust. To her, it means so much that they keep the Jewish faith going strong forever.
    She does a good job of explaining what it means to her, and I can applaud her integrity while at the same time being dismayed by the bigotry. Her argument that the girl she prefers already knows the culture while her son's pick would have to learn is very weak imo. If one argues that it is OK for Esther to want a DIL of her own background, it is hypocritical to call other people "racist" for wanting DILs of their own backgrounds. It is either all OK, or all not OK. Take your pick.

    Yes, they say that a child is Jewish only if the mother is Jewish, because theoretically the mother might have screwed around, and thus paternity was never a certainty (of course I suppose all the Jewish people could get together and decide to overturn that patriarchal nonsense, or call for DNA testing these days instead, but that would not be sticking to tradition!) But if a gentile converts, as Charlotte did in Sex and the City, she then "counts" as Jewish, so I guess now "being Jewish" is considered more in cultural rather than genetic terms. But guess which other people in the 20th century were on a cultural purity kick? That's right, the Germans. Ironic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Beachmom;3279201;
    Mrs. B. ... I'm not saying she doesn't want a certain type for JoJo, but I think she's a lot more tolerant than we are led to believe!
    Well, she herself clearly married outside of her own "race"/culture.
    Last edited by Harvest; 01-15-2009 at 07:07 PM.

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