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Thread: FORT Koffee Klatch

  1. #22401
    FORT Fogey Punkin's Avatar
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    I'm sorry. I didn't realize you were talking of cases you know of personally and I have no reason to doubt you. Maybe we could look outside of Canada to one of the many modern industrial economies where universal care seems to work for everyone. But if you don't want to disparage it, what in the heck are we talking about? :>)

    Maybe we have veered off subject. What was the subject? Unfair taxation? The 'poverty' class living high off the hog by getting everything for free? Who started this? :>)

  2. #22402
    CCL
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    Climbing Solsbury Hill CCL's Avatar
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks View Post
    Perhaps it's different depending on the province, but the *only* healthcare stories I've heard from friends in Canada have been disasters with treatment either refused (until it was too late to do anything) or put off for a year while the person (a very young adult) was in agony. Not the way it would have been handled here. Doctors holding themselves up as gods, refusing copies of medical records, refusing to discuss cases, refusing second opinions. I'm not surprised if this isn't everyone's experience in Canada because it would mean the entire healthcare system had collapsed, but it's nothing I would intentionally submit myself to.
    Right but then you have a system where people can't get urgent health care because they can't afford it. And some of the prices in a pay market system are crazy. In Ontario the price to give birth without provincial coverage is a couple thousand (I know because a friend who wasn't covered as a non-resident had to pay) whereas in the US I've heard it's ten times that. That's crazy.
    I don't doubt there are issues (though I've never experienced anything like the ones you mention, either directly or through friends /family). I wouldn't be surprised at less specialists in the Maritimes - that's down to the smaller population base. Sometimes you have to travel. And I wouldn't be surprised at doctors that thought highly of themselves - I don't think that's exclusive to, or a product of, universal healthcare. But not all doctors are like that.
    Last edited by CCL; 02-19-2014 at 06:56 PM.
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  3. #22403
    Live-Love-Laugh Fanny Mare's Avatar
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Quote Originally Posted by CCL View Post
    Right but then you have a system where people can't get urgent health care because they can't afford it. And some of the prices in a pay market system are crazy. In Ontario the price to give birth without provincial coverage is a couple thousand (I know because a friend who wasn't covered as a non-resident had to pay) whereas in the US I've heard it's ten times that. That's crazy.
    I don't doubt there are issues (though I've never experienced anything like the ones you mention). I wouldn't be surprised at less specialists in the Maritimes - that's down to the smaller population base. Sometimes you have to travel. And I wouldn't be surprised at doctors that thought highly of themselves - I don't think that's exclusive to, or a product of, universal healthcare. But not all doctors are like that.
    I must be lucky, I have GP an OBGYN, and a dermatologist I see regularly, I love them all, and they are busy but never too busy
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  4. #22404
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Quote Originally Posted by Punkin View Post
    ... Maybe the Scandinavian roots explain my attraction to the Social Democracy form of government. ...
    Isn't it interesting how some tendencies can be genetic like that? Watching something on TV about the history of Scotch-Irish hillbillies (part of my roots), I was surprised at how some of the descriptions meshed with my feelings. It's a neat thing to consider.
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  5. #22405
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks View Post
    Perhaps it's different depending on the province, but the *only* healthcare stories I've heard from friends in Canada have been disasters with treatment either refused (until it was too late to do anything) or put off for a year while the person (a very young adult) was in agony. Not the way it would have been handled here. Doctors holding themselves up as gods, refusing copies of medical records, refusing to discuss cases, refusing second opinions. I'm not surprised if this isn't everyone's experience in Canada because it would mean the entire healthcare system had collapsed, but it's nothing I would intentionally submit myself to.
    If someone is in agony, they simply go to ER .Nobody( nobody is turned away) I wouldn't want a system where I have to check my money before I go anywhere- .each to their own. I don't like the system in the US( sorry)
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  6. #22406
    Anarchist AJane's Avatar
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks View Post
    OK, but from my standpoint I'm basing what I said on extensive first-person assessments by Canadian friends, not rumors, and nothing to do with trying to disparge universal care. I'm sure what my friends told me was true. I'm also willing to accept what Fanny Mare described as her experience as being true but I'm not sure I'm prepared yet to believe it's typical.
    As a Canadian who has been employed in the healthcare system in two different provinces, I can assure you that you are misinformed. There are waitlists for some procedures but people are not left "in agony" or to die due to our system. I would be very interested to hear about any country's healthcare system where a "typical" experience would be where citizens were refused treatment or apparently left writhing in pain on a hospital floor.
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  7. #22407
    Red Sox Nation Brooks's Avatar
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Quote Originally Posted by AJane View Post
    As a Canadian who has been employed in the healthcare system in two different provinces, I can assure you that you are misinformed. There are waitlists for some procedures but people are not left "in agony" or to die due to our system. I would be very interested to hear about any country's healthcare system where a "typical" experience would be where citizens were refused treatment or apparently left writhing in pain on a hospital floor.
    The procedure which was made unavailable for at least a year had to do with female plumbing. The one refused treatment until it was too late was for colon cancer - it was treatable when diagnosed but not by the time many months later when the doctors were finally willing to consider doing something about it. Neither was a situation where someone was writhing on a hospital floor or could have gone to the ER for adequate relief.

    A grand sample size of two, the only two Canadian friends I have discussed medical issues with. Perhaps it never came up with any of my other Canadian friends because they weren't having difficulties with the Canadian system.
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  8. #22408
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Quote Originally Posted by AJane View Post
    As a Canadian who has been employed in the healthcare system in two different provinces, I can assure you that you are misinformed. There are waitlists for some procedures but people are not left "in agony" or to die due to our system. I would be very interested to hear about any country's healthcare system where a "typical" experience would be where citizens were refused treatment or apparently left writhing in pain on a hospital floor.
    I find different ( horror stories) all over the globe. If anyone thinks Canada is remotely bad, they should live in the UK..there unless you go private, you are left in agony
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  9. #22409
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Ugh! Enough snow already!
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    Count your blessings!

  10. #22410
    runs with scissors waywyrd's Avatar
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    Re: FORT Koffee Klatch

    Quote Originally Posted by Gutmutter View Post
    Ugh! Enough snow already!
    I hope we're done with it here. Last week, ice storm. Today, low 80's. Yesterday I planted cool weather stuff in my garden.
    It was me. I let the dogs out.

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