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Thread: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

  1. #11
    FORT Fogey redsox girl's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    JMO. we can argue about the horns but who says a sea creature can`t have any? Where is that written? Her good witch and demon worked well as a cohesive unit, more so than the others. I don't think it's fair to diminish her accomplishments and talent by saying she won because America likes to vote for a comeback kid or because she had the luxurary of a week away. She had to earn her way back in. And, its not like she made up the rule, so why hold it aqgainst her? Maybe, just maybe, her final work impressed the most people, generally speaking.
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  2. #12
    Bloomin' FoRT Fanatic! ness's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Thoughts, opinions, observations and Thursday-afternoon quarterbacking . . .

    jade . . .

    I caught it, too, that McKenzie didn't ask Roy about his post-show goings-on. So, I'm going to assume he's still the makeup/costume chief at Netherworld, right now. But as the live finale was last night and he was in LA, I'm supposing that he had trusted subordinates/seconds-in-command who basically ARE him to shepherd Netherworld through Halloween season.

    *** The following was added after hitting the Net for more info . . .

    I've attached a link below to an EW article from McKenzie about the final. That article also leads to a link to an exit interview with Roy. Both are very interesting. One of the things Roy says is that he DID work on a movie after Face Off wrapped, and that CC now works with him at Netherworld. I'm going to assume that maybe Roy was under contract to keep his mouth shut about that movie he worked on, and that is why McKenzie didn't bring it up. Maybe? Not sure, because HE sure brought it up in that EW article.

    And that article also allows him to go into an in-depth explanation of his feelings regarding Nicole's return and ascendance to the F3.

    Again, I get where he's coming from.

    McKenzie, in HER article, also offers a judges' take on WHY Roy was eliminated. I found it interesting, but didn't agree with what their take was.

    Nicole . . .

    Yes, I'm glad a woman won. No, I don't think the overall body of work during the course of the series was taken into consideration by the voters. Had it been, Laura would've won. Again, McKenzie's EW article (BEFORE the finale aired) makes reference to the fact that the voters --- when considering just who it was that they wanted to vote for --- needed to consider the entire body of work over the course of the series. No slam to Nicole, had that been done, Laura (despite her demon) would've wound up the winner.

    I'm very happy for Nicole from an artist standpoint, a female standpoint, AND a Comeback Kid standpoint. But, I think --- even though her final two makeups together WERE better than Laura's (Laura's demon missed the mark; her Earth Witch was great) --- had the voters factored overall body of work into their voting considerations, Laura would've still won.

    And, obviously, that gorgeous staff of Roy's being left by him in a place where bull-in-a-china-shop Tommy could take it out didn't hurt Nicole in the end for lack of it being there.

    Laura - Even though her demon was not great, I think Nicole's Comeback Kid factor did her in. Shame. But she's not going to be hurting for Hollywood work. And I DID love her Earth Witch.

    Derek - OK. I liked his Fire Witch better than his demon. And, to me, his Fire Witch was NOT the best of the three, anyway, so that's not saying a lot, I guess.

    Personally? I really do wish that the Face Off PTB would NEVER allow fans to select the ultimate winner again. The judges on this show, for the most part, and moreso that most competition shows, seem pretty reasonable, MOST of the time. Not ALWAYS, but then again, they're human and not perfect, either. But I usually agree with MOST of what they say, and thus far, actually DO respect them, still. Unlike another dancing reality show which shall remain nameless, for purposes of this thread.

    I also heartily wish that the Face Off PTB would NEVER allow a booted-off entrant to return again. I understand the "WTF?!" factor, and putting a light under the others' rears to step up their game. And, particularly now, after the fans have been allowed to vote for the ultimate winner, I ABSOLUTELY understand and can see where that'd stick in the craw of someone who worked all the way through and earned the spot they were standing in when the ousted contestant's resurrection occurred.

    JMHO.

    'Face Off': Host McKenzie Westmore on this season's most memorable looks, her advice to fans voting for the winner -- PHOTOS | PopStyle | EW.com

    'Face Off' exit interview: Roy Wooley | PopStyle | EW.com
    Last edited by ness; 11-01-2012 at 08:29 PM.
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  3. #13
    Bloomin' FoRT Fanatic! ness's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by jadewarlock View Post
    Does anyone else feel there was a possibility they were supposed to have a final FOUR until Joe quit? The reason I say this is that most people see the elements as earth, air and fire (mostly due to the band of the same name).

    But here we have earth, air, fire and water.

    While in seasons past they've had an extra one or two elements, when you also add that there was NO elimination that first episode, and no double eliminations I can recall, this means that there was most likely that possibility.

    All it does is make me loathe Joe and his attitude and quitting (though here I didn't mind) more and would validate a reason for Roy to be pissed or angry - legitimately he could've been a finalist and could've won.
    Good observations and points, jade.
    "In a world of pollution, profanity, adolescence, broccoli, zits, ozone depletion, racism, sexism, stupid guys and PMS, why the hell do people still tell me to have a nice day?" - Unknown

  4. #14
    FORT Fogey jadewarlock's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by ness View Post
    Thoughts, opinions, observations and Thursday-afternoon quarterbacking . . .

    jade . . .

    I caught it, too, that McKenzie didn't ask Roy about his post-show goings-on. So, I'm going to assume he's still the makeup/costume chief at Netherworld, right now. But as the live finale was last night and he was in LA, I'm supposing that he had trusted subordinates/seconds-in-command who basically ARE him to shepherd Netherworld through Halloween season.

    *** The following was added after hitting the Net for more info . . .

    I've attached a link below to an EW article from McKenzie about the final. That article also leads to a link to an exit interview with Roy. Both are very interesting. One of the things Roy says is that he DID work on a movie after Face Off wrapped, and that CC now works with him at Netherworld. I'm going to assume that maybe Roy was under contract to keep his mouth shut about that movie he worked on, and that is why McKenzie didn't bring it up. Maybe? Not sure, because HE sure brought it up in that EW article.

    And that article also allows him to go into an in-depth explanation of his feelings regarding Nicole's return and ascendance to the F3.

    Again, I get where he's coming from.

    McKenzie, in HER article, also offers a judges' take on WHY Roy was eliminated. I found it interesting, but didn't agree with what their take was.
    Speaking as someone who actually WAS in a film as an extra - you are silenced unless you get permission from the company itself to do an interview on it. Me thinks that he had permission to say that he did work on a movie but not which one yet because it's either in production still/post-production (editing and the like) or - I would love to think this but unlikely - he is actually working in "Catching Fire" as well (I say unlikely because his work doesn't match what they do in the film version of the series; however, they could've decided to update the makeups to fit more along the lines of teh books, which does allow creature art).

    Sounds like the judges' reasoning is not what we think - i.e. maybe Roy didn't need the money as much - so I'll have to read it.

    [quote]Nicole . . .

    Yes, I'm glad a woman won. No, I don't think the overall body of work during the course of the series was taken into consideration by the voters. Had it been, Laura would've won. Again, McKenzie's EW article (BEFORE the finale aired) makes reference to the fact that the voters --- when considering just who it was that they wanted to vote for --- needed to consider the entire body of work over the course of the series. No slam to Nicole, had that been done, Laura (despite her demon) would've wound up the winner.

    I'm very happy for Nicole from an artist standpoint, a female standpoint, AND a Comeback Kid standpoint. But, I think --- even though her final two makeups together WERE better than Laura's (Laura's demon missed the mark; her Earth Witch was great) --- had the voters factored overall body of work into their voting considerations, Laura would've still won.

    And, obviously, that gorgeous staff of Roy's being left by him in a place where bull-in-a-china-shop Tommy could take it out didn't hurt Nicole in the end for lack of it being there.
    [quote]

    As much as I love Laura - I have to say that it's not a guarantee she'd won. The only reason I say that is because it's possible too that she and Derek split the votes and Nicole edge in (same with any of them).

    Laura did have the best portfolio of the three, then I'd rank it Nicole and Derek, so at least we got one of the top two portfolios as the winner. Laura though I do not think will be hurting from not winning this show as you mentioned.

    Derek - OK. I liked his Fire Witch better than his demon. And, to me, his Fire Witch was NOT the best of the three, anyway, so that's not saying a lot, I guess.

    Personally? I really do wish that the Face Off PTB would NEVER allow fans to select the ultimate winner again. The judges on this show, for the most part, and moreso that most competition shows, seem pretty reasonable, MOST of the time. Not ALWAYS, but then again, they're human and not perfect, either. But I usually agree with MOST of what they say, and thus far, actually DO respect them, still. Unlike another dancing reality show which shall remain nameless, for purposes of this thread.

    I also heartily wish that the Face Off PTB would NEVER allow a booted-off entrant to return again. I understand the "WTF?!" factor, and putting a light under the others' rears to step up their game. And, particularly now, after the fans have been allowed to vote for the ultimate winner, I ABSOLUTELY understand and can see where that'd stick in the craw of someone who worked all the way through and earned the spot they were standing in when the ousted contestant's resurrection occurred.

    JMHO.

    'Face Off': Host McKenzie Westmore on this season's most memorable looks, her advice to fans voting for the winner -- PHOTOS | PopStyle | EW.com

    'Face Off' exit interview: Roy Wooley | PopStyle | EW.com
    I think both of those will be factored into next season's decisions. That has NOTHING to do with Nicole or her winning - she like all of them (well save Joe) played the game by the rules presented. I DO agree with the no more public voting the winner - again not against Nicole, but we did have an underdog winner vibe going on here and while she did show her full potential in the final look, I think we can almost say that had Roy not put on that stupid wig on his makeup he'd been there instead of Nicole for the final three.

    The flip of a Roy-Laura-Derek final three though is I think we'd had people split the vote on Roy and Laura and we'd had the weakest of the final four - Derek - Win.

  5. #15
    FORT Fogey jadewarlock's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Just read Roy's interview and I agree - Roy's answer about Nicole is spot on. I love too that he does not blame Nicole for any of it - it's the game itself, and the producer's decision. (in defense of Nicole - I do think they would've sequestered them with the same rules as the contestants, so I don't think Nicole did research. She would've had the rest though and that does factor in makeup designs).

    And - he is right on the hair but the problem was the wig looked fake. That I think hurt him, and as far as the chest details... well, he is right but you have to be careful on that at times.

    Love the fact he hired CC in a heart beat for the haunted house - she has class and can design fairly well in her makeups. I actually liked her Day of the Dead makeup as well.

    And I loved how he taught other artists how to fabricate items, such as the spiderweb (which was really cool). The best thing he did on that show was enhance their skills and talents - in spite of a contest - to better their futures. If they had done a popularity vote for a consolation prize, I think he'd won it in a heartbeat, and deservedly so.

    Read McKenzie's explanation as to why Roy's elimination - I"m sorry, but his makeups WERE completed - head to toe looks. That was an excuse to eliminate him over having a strong chance that a woman would win for the first time in the show IMHO.

    And no, I'm not defending him in regard to his choice of the wig; however, this is a very poor analysis of why Roy was eliminated. Yes, she is a Westmore of the very popular Westmores of makeup; however I cannot see this as a legitimate reason as to being the final determining factor of Roy's elimination.
    Last edited by jadewarlock; 11-02-2012 at 12:10 AM.

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    FORT Fogey Gala62's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Well! TPTB created a lot of drama this season. Different for FaceOff and I'm not sure I like it.

    ITA...I hope they take out the viewer voting next season.

    I think once everyone saw they had strong women contenders at last, there was every effort made to create a favorable environment for one of them to win. From bringing Nicole back (there were at least 2 others that were equally good on that challenge) to eliminating Roy, the strongest man....it was pretty clear.

    Now granted- both Nicole and Laura have mad skills, but Laura winning would've gone down a bit better though for most of us I think.
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  7. #17
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by jadewarlock View Post
    Does anyone else feel there was a possibility they were supposed to have a final FOUR until Joe quit? The reason I say this is that most people see the elements as earth, air and fire (mostly due to the band of the same name).

    But here we have earth, air, fire and water.

    While in seasons past they've had an extra one or two elements, when you also add that there was NO elimination that first episode, and no double eliminations I can recall, this means that there was most likely that possibility.

    All it does is make me loathe Joe and his attitude and quitting (though here I didn't mind) more and would validate a reason for Roy to be pissed or angry - legitimately he could've been a finalist and could've won.
    While there wasn't an elimination in the first episode per se, we did have a reduction in force. And then Nicole was brough back, so I don't think they ever intended a final four.

    I was OK with Nicole winning, but I was still pulling for & voted for Laura. At least it was a girl. And I think we may see creations from alll 3 of them in the future.

  8. #18
    Bloomin' FoRT Fanatic! ness's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Thoughts, opinions, observations . . .

    jade . . . Glad you read the links. Your take on what McKenzie said about why Roy was bounced was the same as MY take.

    Impressive makeup pedigree notwithstanding, I think McKenzie's "explanation" of why Roy was bounced was pure, total, utter, TPTB/show producer BS. My eyes may not be the GREATEST in the world, but there was no way in HELL that Roy did not deliver completed/finished makeups on those challenges he worked on, from what I saw. Facts are facts. On the Grimm challenge, Roy'd done what he'd been CLEARLY told/ordered to do about fabrication, BY THE JUDGES. He chose to NOT DO ANY FABRICATION AT ALL. His choice to keep that hideous wig is what did him in.

    And even with her impressive makeup pedigree, far as I know, McKenzie HAS NEVER ACTUALLY BEEN A MAKEUP ARTIST HERSELF. She, IS, however, the daughter of a Hollywood makeup titan, and, through that connection, would probably have FORGOTTEN most of what these contestants never even knew or learned about makeup application for movie, TV and theatrical productions. Also, she IS the host and "face" of Face Off, and therefore, an employee of the series. So, who better for TPTB to use for their fall girl about why Roy got bounced BUT McKenzie? And she's no fool; SURE she'd say what she'd been told to say.

    And even with that, what to me is MORE telling is that in his critiques, not ONCE do I ever recall Roy getting slammed by ANY of the judges about NOT HAVING A COMPLETED MAKEUP. In the case of the Grimm makeup, yeah, it was completed BADLY with that bad porn star wig. But, IT WAS COMPLETED. Sure, Glenn made it plain prior to the crits on THAT particular challenge that Roy was OTT with his consistent fabrications (i.e., using a baseball bat to kill a cockroach, essentially). And he responded positively, and accordingly by not doing any fabrication at all on the Grimm challenge.

    He just totally screwed up with that damn wig, is all.

    Personally, I hope TPTB DO read this board. And IF they do, I would HOPE they'd have the guts to actually explain --- CHALLENGE BY CHALLENGE --- exactly HOW it was that Roy did not have a completed makeup on every challenge that he did for himself, or worked on with another artist. Or, even better yet, have the JUDGES explain that, challenge by challenge.

    But, we all know, that ain't never gonna happen. In THIS lifetime, or any other.

    Since TPTB are obviously going to use McKenzie as the fall girl for why they make the decisions they do, then it seems to me that they need to come up with logical, more believable stories for her to spout for them, and for us to try to swallow.

    JMHO.
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  9. #19
    FORT Fogey jadewarlock's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Thanks Ness. In my opinion there were only TWO incomplete looks, and both cost the person their spot in the game.

    These were Tommy's Dishonored makeup

    and

    Alana's - Seuss makeup.

    In fact, IMHO Tommy's zombie rabbit also hit the border with me, as even Nicole's Alice was more complete.

    In all honesty, I wish Nicole hadn't been eliminated that challenge and instead Tommy was because I think even then she had the better makeup - and we'd have less of the snipping of Nicole winning on the SyFy (I really wish they'd revert to SciFi again) page.

    Oh and I agree with the judges challenge from you: because honestly I think this was more of a PRODUCTION stance, not the judges. Not ONCE did I hear any of them say he had an incomplete look. Far from it - even his wig faux pax they just said they hated the wig, not that it looked like it was incomplete.
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  10. #20
    FORT Fogey redsox girl's Avatar
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    Re: 10/31 finale part 2 *Spoilers*

    Based on some of the comments here I want to come to the defense of those who voted for Nicole. Don`t assume we based our votes only on her final look. Intentional or not, that opinion sounds a wee bit condescending. Like the rest of you, most of us voted for our favorite artist based on the entire body of work. Yes, there are some voters who base their votes on any number of reasons other than the best body of work, but it occurs in every group. People who voted for Nicole, generally speaking, are no less astute in the thought process of casting votes than are those who voted for Laura.
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