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Thread: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

  1. #151
    FORT Fanatic DancingDad's Avatar
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    I too abhor the vitriol being served up against Chaz. I don't expect him to go far, but I do hope that his (and Lacey's) positive attitude will quell the uproar from all the bigots out there.

    On another topic I just saw an article on Yahoo News where the preseason betting odds have been posted. Here they are:

    Elisabetta Canalis 3/1
    Carson Kressley 4/1
    Kristin Cavallari 5/1
    Chynna Phillips 6/1
    Robert Kardashian 15/2
    Hope Solo 8/1
    Ron Artest 10/1
    David Arquette 10/1
    J.R. Martinez 12/1
    Ricki Lake 15/1
    Nancy Grace 18/1
    Chaz Bono 20/1

    If Derek manages to pull off a 4th win will this convince everyone that he can bring the best out with a less physically gifted star?

  2. #152
    FORT Fogey Tobi's Avatar
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    Frankly, what people do is up to them but what I don't understand is why ABC chooses this venue to stir the pot. Whether it's with Bristol and her single mother thing then abstinence message, what's her name with one leg, elderly people that seem a little senile (Cloris, cough) the constant drumming up of the disparaged gay that they dare to cast (to which everyone shrugs, so?) and hunting down anyone who might not feel the same way and call them a racist, bigot, idiot, phobic and whatever else one can think of to call someone who doesn't happen to want to discuss people's sex lives. I personally don't care what people do but I am SICK TO DEATH OF HEARING ABOUT IT!!!!! ABC is loving the controversy that probably doesn't even exist to any real extent...they are just getting props for stirring the pot. I am kinda sick of their gimmicky puppet string pulling to get a rise out of people, aren't there enough other shows that do that? Why has ABC decided to make a dancing show "message-y" It's so corny... Enough already.
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  3. #153
    *Until Next Season...* karalott's Avatar
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    Quote Originally Posted by Tobi View Post
    Frankly, what people do is up to them but what I don't understand is why ABC chooses this venue to stir the pot. Whether it's with Bristol and her single mother thing then abstinence message, what's her name with one leg, elderly people that seem a little senile (Cloris, cough) the constant drumming up of the disparaged gay that they dare to cast (to which everyone shrugs, so?) and hunting down anyone who might not feel the same way and call them a racist, bigot, idiot, phobic and whatever else one can think of to call someone who doesn't happen to want to discuss people's sex lives. I personally don't care what people do but I am SICK TO DEATH OF HEARING ABOUT IT!!!!! ABC is loving the controversy that probably doesn't even exist to any real extent...they are just getting props for stirring the pot. I am kinda sick of their gimmicky puppet string pulling to get a rise out of people, aren't there enough other shows that do that? Why has ABC decided to make a dancing show "message-y" It's so corny... Enough already.
    I just want to watch people dance, or learn to dance if they aren't a ringer. I could care less about showmances, drama, fights between partners and judges, controversy over comments, costumes, song choices, dance moves, a person's backstory, and how the producers fuel it by cateringto those contestants while other who don't come in with watercooler buzz get thrown to the lions. I just want to watch and enjoy, and learn about the unknown celebs/pros, and enjoy watching the ones that I do know and like. I'm tired of the stunt casting like Bristol, Kate, etc, and the buzz the show creates around the controversy. I'm sure they'd cry if it didn't get any backlash. One headline I saw said "Bono polarizes America". I think that's a little much. I'm all for Chaz doing the show. I just don't like the show milking it, and how it went with Bristol when she lasted beyond her expiration date. I feel like the same could be said this season of Nancy, J.R., and, if they want any showmances, Hope/Maks and Kristin/Mark. I would think that the majority of viewers (the 20+ million that there are), watch and don't put labels to everyone. To those that vote, I don't they're voting for someone and thinking about them being gay, straight, transgendered, white, black, male, female, etc. Everyone's got their own criteria. I vote for who I like, and if they aren't the absolute worst dancer, they'll get my votes. If someone that I barely know anything about is partnered with one of my favorite pros, I'm willing to give them votes to help them stick around. Reading various comments online, it seems most people are looking forward to good comedy from Carson, and to see Nancy and Rob fall flat on their faces. As long as I'm being entertained, it's a good season.

    If Derek manages to pull off a 4th win will this convince everyone that he can bring the best out with a less physically gifted star?
    My biggest complaint about Derek has been that he has never, ever, received any type of partner that comes with the baggage or dancing ability of someone like Kate Gosselin or Cloris Leachman. Everyone of his partners has either been young, fit, a ringer that could pass as a pro, or someone who had beyond average potential. I also thought his partnerships with Joanna and Brooke were overrated. It's as though he's held to a completely different standard, and that the judges (particularly his two biggest groupies, CA and Bruno), act as though everything he touches is gold, that someone like Nicole couldn't dance like that before she came on the show, and that everything he does is like something they've never seen. He does a non jive and quick step, they call him out, yet they still give him high marks. As a fan of other pros who haven't won, and who have had their share of clunkers and head cases, I'm ready for them to win. Derek's talented, but I think all the pros are talented, and when given the right partner, can do amazing things with their choreography. Take Tony for example; he couldn't give a routine he gave to Stacey or Audrina to someone like Kate or Wendy. Ricki's going in with what seems like the biggest fan base and hype; whether she lives up to it and turns out to be another ringer in the making or finally is someone average we'll see. It seems like I've just accepted whoever Derek gets will likely win. I hope there's a lot of surprises this season, that they don't make it obvious or predictable, and that there's no sugar coating that stunt casting or gushing over their favorites. So those betting odds actually have Elizabetta as the one to beat? Or is that who they expect to go first?
    Last edited by karalott; 09-02-2011 at 02:27 AM.
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  4. #154
    FORT Fogey nanarama's Avatar
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    Such good comments, Kara.
    I don't have anything against Chaz and feel his personal choices are none of my business, but I wish DWTS would stick to making the show about dancing and the journey that the contestants go on instead of trying for controversy. Many of us enjoyed last season for the lack of controversy - with the exception of a little obnoxious behavior by Mark late in the season. I wish the show didn't try to incite drama and bring in politics and morally divisive issues. My feelings as to whether Chaz "has a right to be on the show" have more to do with the fact that his biggest claim to fame is that he is the child of someone famous. If his mother wasn't Cher would he even be considered for the show? Of course not! I prefer seeing people who are themselves atheletes, singers, comedians and actors competing - but we know how well DWTS fulfills that criteria!
    As for Derek, I'm really curious to see how well he does with Ricki. She was fun to watch on "Hairspray," but I'm curious to see if she has any dancing skills or if Derek will actually have a struggle this season.
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  5. #155
    FORT Fogey Minney's Avatar
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    Quote Originally Posted by Tobi View Post
    Frankly, what people do is up to them but what I don't understand is why ABC chooses this venue to stir the pot. Whether it's with Bristol and her single mother thing then abstinence message, what's her name with one leg, elderly people that seem a little senile (Cloris, cough) the constant drumming up of the disparaged gay that they dare to cast (to which everyone shrugs, so?) and hunting down anyone who might not feel the same way and call them a racist, bigot, idiot, phobic and whatever else one can think of to call someone who doesn't happen to want to discuss people's sex lives. I personally don't care what people do but I am SICK TO DEATH OF HEARING ABOUT IT!!!!! ABC is loving the controversy that probably doesn't even exist to any real extent...they are just getting props for stirring the pot. I am kinda sick of their gimmicky puppet string pulling to get a rise out of people, aren't there enough other shows that do that? Why has ABC decided to make a dancing show "message-y" It's so corny... Enough already.
    Don't forget DWTS has also become the second home to publicly dumped fiance's who own the corner on the sympathy vote.

  6. #156
    Lux et Veritas chrisg's Avatar
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    Where should we draw a line of eliminating people from DWTS consideration, though, due to potential controversy? Should Carson Kressley not be on the show because, to some people – actually a lot of people - he represents a morality issue and a political issue rather than being seen as a fellow human being primarily? And, because of that, I don’t think the show is the fundamental source of generating discord in all of these instances but there is also societal prejudice strongly at play and a general tendency to politicize people - who haven’t even been tangentially involved in politics - rather than society viewing them as fellow human beings first and foremost.

    If I was driven by viewing everything through an extreme left wing political paradigm, for example, I’d simply see JR as a symbol of Bush’s Iraq war and go nuts over that and characterize him as representing something political, moral and a cause I don’t support. That’s not how I personally view the world, though, and I see JR as a tremendously inspirational individual with a very personal story of triumph over adversity. I view Chaz and Carson as having personal courage, as well, due to the bigotry they have had to face.

    And, frankly, I think the way we move past discrimination as a society is by being inclusive rather than excluding people for fear of risking offending those that lose it seemingly primarily because some people are different from them. And I don’t believe we can lay responsibility for that at the feet of DWTS since it is a recognized societal pattern. The example we're all familiar with is society losing it over integration in the sixties. Thankfully, we have mostly gotten over it –- but it wasn’t through exclusion, it was through inclusion -- and then society slowly emerged from its prejudicial fear, essentially by seeing, ‘These are people, that aren't that different from me in the ways that matter.’

    Well I see Chaz, Carson and JR as people who aren't different from me in any ways that matter in a negative sense. Chaz - like Laila Ali - is the offspring of a very famous person on DWTS. Oh, at least I'd heard of Chaz before, though.
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    "Do you want to change the world?...Think Different, Be Different...Stay Hungry, Stay Foolish…Now, let’s go invent tomorrow.” – Steven Paul Jobs

  7. #157
    FORT Fogey nanarama's Avatar
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    Carson is a tv personality who has actually had his own show. No problem with him being on - in fact, I'm looking forward to it. He's a hoot!
    Laila was (is?) a boxer. While not as well known as her famous father, she has had a career where she is an athlete and was famous in her own right. Not a problem with her either.
    For me, the problem is when people are put on the show purely for the controvery they will generate or because they are the off-spring of someone famous, or both. Can you imagine another transgender contestant being asked to be on the show?
    In the end, the show for me is mindless fluff just watching famous people learn to dance. Yes, I'll still watch this season, but I really I don't care to mix in social commentary.

    Oh! And I'll state one more time, lest I be misunderstood, that I wish Chaz well and hope he has a lifetime of happiness. He made the decision to do what was right for him and I can't judge.
    Last edited by nanarama; 09-02-2011 at 04:44 PM. Reason: Clarity

  8. #158
    Lux et Veritas chrisg's Avatar
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    I can imagine Alexis Arquette being asked to do DWTS, as has been discussed. And who is famous 'in their own right' is relative, as I had never heard of Laila Ali.

    Many things can be turned into negative controversy - given sufficient motivation - and I used JR Martinez as an example of that. Continuing with his comparison, I'm also sure there are soap stars that might widely be considered more 'famous' than JR who would have loved to do DWTS this season -- particularly as soaps are becoming an endangered species. And I wouldn't be surprised if DWTS might have cynically chosen JR over them with the thought of exploiting both his injuries and his involvement in a controversial war just as they may be doing with Chaz' unique background.

    Even if that is the case, though, I also believe that that paradigm can be flipped to see the positives and I, personally, see quite a bit of courage to be inspired by in the life stories of JR and Chaz. I did see your earlier comments about Chaz, Nana, and found them very accepting. I just have a different perspective with regard to looking at society's responsibility when it comes to what engenders controversy and a desire to flip the script on DWTS - regardless of what their motivation may be - to see the positives in Chaz' participation in the show, including the possibility that his doing the show will ultimately help to generate even further acceptance toward those who are different.

    Have a great Labor Day Weekend, everyone.
    "Do you want to change the world?...Think Different, Be Different...Stay Hungry, Stay Foolish…Now, let’s go invent tomorrow.” – Steven Paul Jobs

  9. #159
    FORT Fogey
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    I just read an article about that million moms group. Apparently they're protesting not just Chaz's appearance on DWTS but Carson's as well. Um, aren't they aware that Louis, who, while not on the show this year, has been on for many seasons, is gay? He certainly hasn't hidden that fact. Or what about Lance Bass? And Margaret Cho is a bisexual. Have they never noticed that Bruno is a judge? Has all of that escaped their attention? Don't misunderstand--I think they're making a ridiculously huge deal out of Chaz being on a show "when children can watch." But for them to object to Carson seems even stupider, unless they've objected to Louis, Lance, Margaret, and Bruno as well. If they have, then they've already not been watching the show for some time (or even from the beginning, if they objected to Bruno). If they haven't, what, in particular, makes Carson any more objectionable than every other gay/bisexual person who's ever participated?

    I also think their fervor over the show being on "when children can watch" is so over the top. If you don't want your kids watching the show, then don't let them watch. Not everything on every station from 7 p.m. to 9 p.m. is going to be perfect viewing for kids for any number of reasons. Heck, I'm surprised they'd have ever let their kids watch DWTS in the first place, considering some of the costumes that get worn. Kids might or might not even know that Chaz was once Chastity, but they sure couldn't miss the costumes (or lack thereof) on some of the dancers.

    I also find it particularly objectionable that they're commanding that "Christians" not watch. A number of Christian denominations now allow for openly gay people to enter the ministry, including those in committed relationships (that's the ELCA stand, for instance). I imagine if the largest Lutheran denomination allows gays in their pulpits, they'd allow them on their dance floors. Is this group now deciding who are actually to be considered Christians and who aren't? Who put them in charge of that?

    On a semi-related note, I just found out that Carson competes as an equestrian with American Saddlebreds at a national level. Technically, he could be considered an athlete as well as a television host, even if most people don't follow equestrian events the way they follow football. He's also said that he didn't care if he was partnered with a woman or a man; either one is fine with him. Oh, yeah, and that he found it difficult to believe that people would object to a gay contestant being on a ballroom dancing show, since ballroom dancing is "already pretty gay" as it is.

    And he's been asked to help design his costumes--he wants to be a sparkly Fred Astaire.

  10. #160
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    Re: *Dancing With the Stars Season 13 (Fall) News & Speculation*

    Oops--slight correction. Carson and his American Saddlebred, Enchanted Memories, won the amateur gentleman's title at the 2009 World's Horse Fair in Louisville, so he's actually competed (and won) on a world level as opposed to a national level. He's been riding since he was little, and he bought his first horse at sixteen, so he's been competing at one level or another for quite some time.

    There's footage of him and Enchanted Memories on youtube, if anyone's interested.

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