5/24 Finals Part 2 Discussion Thread **Spoilers**

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Originally Posted by anders332

I watched Hines FS last night and was not impressed, how on earth did that earn all 10s??

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I'm sure Mark will gert blamed for it :winkgrin

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Originally Posted by KatesMom

I know this is not your position and you were replying to someone else, but I wanted to include your post for the bolded statement. If this was a professional competition, M/C would not have won because they would have been disqualified early for breaking the rules. As it is, this is not a professional dancing competition, but an entertainment show. However, it is still an entertainment show with RULES. If you don't like the rules, fine. If you want to break the rules and take your chances, fine. But there are plenty of people, myself included, who feel like Mark's (and Derek's) constant attempts to break the rules, while the other dancers comply, is BS. In my mind, a truly creative and talented person does not need to break the rules to show off their talent. A TRULY talented and creative person can show off their creativity and talent while staying inside the rules. Kym and Chelsie being two standout examples.

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also if you read my entire post you would see it was taken out of context.

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Originally Posted by MFWalkoff

I was surprised that M&C chose the Harry Potter dance -- it was one of Mark's worst offenses in terms of dancing around Chelsea and not giving her enough to do. I wasn't that impressed with it, and all the 10s from the judges made my jaw drop. But if a star doesn't have a voting fanbase, they're not going to win no matter how many 10s they get. I'm glad that Mark got splashed with that cold reality this year. He needs to grow up.

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I had originally heard, and posted, they were doing their cha cha. Which would have made more sense. If anything they should have just done their jive, since the judges were free with the 10 paddles last night. I was surprised they were doing the VW, of all dances. That was the turning point for Mark being a tool and the show putting them in the fake bottom 2 as punishment for breaking the rules. Maybe TPTB told them to change dance styles since Kirstie was already doing the cha cha?

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That was Alec Mazo. John's partner's name was Charlotte (or Christine) Jorgenson? Or something like that. I don't think she has been on any season since the first. Alec came back to dance with Natalie Coughlin, and hasn't he since basically said he won't do it again? Wasn't there some issue when Edyta left about not liking the way the show treated him?

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Alec has been back I think 5 times total. Season 4 and 5 he was out early, season 7 and 9 he was out mid-way. That was the rumor, that Edyta was tired of the treatment she was getting, as well as Alec not being included more in the show. For being a winner, he's now the only one to have won once. And he kind of gets the ugly stepchild treatment, imo. I am completely ready for a new pro to win next season. I'd love to see it be Louis, Tony, Anna, Maks, Karina, or Chelsie. They've all been cheated (in some cases royally) out of the trophy at least once. I'm over seeing people win back to back or how many trophies someone can stack up. It's not the Superbowl, it's a TV dance competition that in 10 years will just be in the reality show hall of fame but pretty much forgotten. This season was much, much better than last season's train wreck. It's why I always worry about the fall seasons. For whatever reason, the spring editions are better. And, since it's the most watched season ever, hopefully TPTB realize they don't need tacky and controversial stunt casting.

I'm all for innovation, but most of these pros innovate within the rules of the specific dance. When I'm told I will see a waltz, or a paso, or a jive, that's what I want to see, not a conglomeration of moves that don't belong. The free style is the place to go all out because there are no rules in the freestyle. Even Swan Lake, one of the best know ballets, has had different interpretations by different choreographer, but it is always ballet. Bring on the new, but respect the traditional as well.

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Originally Posted by redsox girl

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I feel that Kirtie is the one contestant who showed such an amazing arc of growth and even though other contestants had chemistry she and Maks lit up the dance floor and that should count for something -just as important as technique. IN my heart, I think she is the real winner in all of this, as is Maks-she was the every person out there and though her second to last dance wasn't perfect it was quite amazing when you consider her age and weight- that took guts and the ability to take control of her fears and just do it. Wow. I've come away with such a fondness for her and what an inspiration. :yay

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I agree. It took courage to go on the show knowing that she be subjected to a fresh round of weight jokes and comments. I didn't really have any feelings one way or the other about Kirstie at the start of the show and ended up having a lot of respect for her. She didn't whine when things went wrong or got tough, and worked hard

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Originally Posted by Florimel

I'm all for innovation, but most of these pros innovate within the rules of the specific dance. When I'm told I will see a waltz, or a paso, or a jive, that's what I want to see, not a conglomeration of moves that don't belong. The free style is the place to go all out because there are no rules in the freestyle. Even Swan Lake, one of the best know ballets, has had different interpretations by different choreographer, but it is always ballet. Bring on the new, but respect the traditional as well.

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Yes! I wish they'd go back to having two dance styles each week and at the start of each show tell us the requirements of the dance. Dancers should be penalized if the requirements aren't met. As you say, there is tons of room to innovate while staying within the parameters of the particular dance.

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Originally Posted by law638

We are a drinking town with a football problem. I said at the beginning of the season that Hines would capture the fans with that smile. He is truly a wonderful person & does alot for the community. Although, I believed that Ralph was the best dancer, his injury may have been his downfall. Chelsea's freestyle was full of flaws, she stood by waiting for Mark to pick her up & throw her around. I did not like Mark's attitude& yes, I did see him shoot the finger after he did not like the judge's comments. I replayed it to make sure. He acted like a spoiled child. Kirstie was good but not as consistent as Hines. Of course, I voted for Hines but did throw votes to Ralph early in the season. Steeler nation is not just a Pittsburgh thing, it's known worldwide. You can find a terrible towel in a little pub somewhere in Ireland & there is a Steeler bar in Italy. In almost every city, you can find a Steeler bar filled with the Steeler nation.

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same thing with the Red Sox-we have `Red Sox Nation' and we have card carriers all over the globe in every country and even in Antarctica. There's a website you can log onto to see how many people are signed up and carrying cards in each nation. It's a great gimmick. Despite Boston being so significant historically in the making of this nation, Fenway park is the number two tourist destination in Boston. Not just for Americans but for foreign visitors, as well. I suppose that's its 99 years old has a lot to do with it-plus add in the 86 year old `curse' between world series wins and there is something quite mythic about the team.

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Originally Posted by anders332

I watched Hines FS last night and was not impressed, how on earth did that earn all 10s??

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I don't think anybody this year, never mind last night, deserved 10's - when comparing them to previous seasons competitors BUT they all improved, especially Hines and Kirstie, so on that basis I guess they all danced equally well, thus gettting their perfect scores. What impressed me last night and what I was worried about last night was that the judges were going to further mess with the voters by giving out scores that change the results of the show. Giving them equal scores, evened out the playing field for them all, so I was quite pleased with that.

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Originally Posted by Florimel

I'm all for innovation, but most of these pros innovate within the rules of the specific dance. When I'm told I will see a waltz, or a paso, or a jive, that's what I want to see, not a conglomeration of moves that don't belong. The free style is the place to go all out because there are no rules in the freestyle. Even Swan Lake, one of the best know ballets, has had different interpretations by different choreographer, but it is always ballet. Bring on the new, but respect the traditional as well.

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You expressed it perfectly. I agree with you. IMO Mark does follow this, even in free style.

The thing is i find pleasure in what he and Chelsea do- I like watching it and it's really that simple. maybe I'm not cut out to be a DWTS fan because what is most important tome is the enjoyment i feel in watching performances-how do I feel on the inside when i watch a dance? That's more important to me than the rules (or what rules allegedly exist). I'm not a stickler for form. And marks attitude, well, if he was 40 I'd be concerned, but he's young and creative and sometimes that forms a certain cockiness. I went to art school and I was surrounded by it and i participated in it-trust me, i was laboring under the delusion that I was going to break all of the rules-sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't. Some people hated me on a personal level because i wasn't doing what i was supposed to be doing. Some of my attempts were epic failures, some weren't. I was young and I wanted to conquer the world and kick the stuffiness out of the school. I'm sure i was a pain in the a## to some people, but i also know my passion for art drove me and made me feel so alive and full of ideas. I see that in mark and i understand it and i get how people can hate him for the perceived behavior. But, I get it. I really do. It will pass. Right now, he's an ambitious guy who wants to prove himself, right or wrong. I just feel like I get that because i lived part of it and I just don't see him in such black and white terms.

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Originally Posted by redsox girl

also if you read my entire post you would see it was taken out of context.

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I didn't want to re-quote your previous post and take up too much space. I also want you to know I am not attacking you personally, as I did read all your posts from last night and this morning. I understand you were a fan of Mark's and weren't happy Hines won, to the extent you felt he won because people chose to vote for him only to stop Mark from winning. I do appreciate the point you are trying to make, but I don't think it is appropriate here. If Picasso went on an entertainment show where the rules were to create a certain type of artwork each week (or Chaplin act out a certain role each week, ad nauseum), then the same would be true. That is not the appropriate place to chose to break the rules. Yes, sometimes breaking the rules and standing up for what you believe is appropriate and needed to move the establishment forward. This is not that venue. If you are going on a TV show with the specific purpose of breaking the rules - well then in essence you are saying you know more than the producers and the fans who consistently make it the #1 show. Not the place to do it - and just makes him look like an arrogant arse - which is partially where the comments about him have come from this year. If he wants to change things, then he can start his own show, he can teach his own dances, he can do whatever he wants. He signed up for the show. He knew what the rules of the show were. He chose to break them, and he (or rather Chelsea) has had to deal with the consequences of those decisions. I'm sorry, but I disagree with you.