10/13 Show Discussion **Spoilers**

[Andiemywestie]

No matter how good they are, or nice or whatever, I eliminate Ringers from my vote list right from the get go. My definition of a Ringer is a person who makes money, therefore a professional from dancing for entertainment. Period.

I don't care if someone had a couple of lessons in college or took dance as a child, to me if they're not ringing in the cash, they're not ringers.

So Donny was never vote worthy...or Mya or Carter..
I've never changed from that position and I don't think I ever will.

Because at the end of the day, often times if there's 30 seconds of Ballroom in a dance we're getting a load, it's mostly filler of showdance, and that's what professionals are paid to provide.

[sdl]

I don't know Donny has been on tv dancing in the Osmond brothers since 1962. The year I was born. The Donny & Marie show was half skits and Dance routines with Donny and Marie. If we are going to split hairs he also performed as a backup dancer in a Weird Al Yankovic video and has also been on stage with Michael Jackson. Donny has decades more time dancing than Mya has on this earth. I don't see either as a ringer.

let not forget Donny's answer to Latoya Jacksons question

"Rumor has it that you've been rehearsing for a year with a private trainer in Utah. Is that true?"

No, that's not true," Donny initially replied.

Donny:

"I will clarify because I have been taking dancing lessons to learn ballroom for the dances that we do in Vegas," he continued, referring to his Las Vegas show with sister Marie, who previously competed on the show. "That's part of the choreography, but it's a whole different thing than what we're doing here."

this sounds like a candidate for the "ringer" to me

**************
I appreciate what you are saying, I really do, and it makes sense on paper.
But you really have to watch the videos of both Donny and Mya performing pre-DWTS to understand the difference. What they do in their shows are not even close, and the skill levels are from different worlds.
Donny is an old fashioned singer who kind of steps to the music - like strutting down a set of stairs or turning to his partner at more or less the same time, but the guy wasn't then and isn't now a dancer. He's a guy who tries to move on stage while singing. Definitely nothing that most people couldn't pull off.
Mya - the best way to describe it is to think of how Janet Jackson dances in her music videos. Super high energy, heavily choreographed, top of her game quality dancing. Best of the best.
I wish I knew how to bring some youtube links over here so everyone could see what I'm talking about - after watching them perform, I thought Donnie didn't have enough to go very far in this competition. I thought Mya should be on the pro side, teaching as she does on one video that looks exactly like rehearsal footage from DWTS.
I feel like I'm wearing this out, but I can't get it through my head how the producers thought this was going to work out. And now that she is choreographing her own routines - that just leaves me speechless.

[sdl]

I would like to apologize in advance to Andie, to the extent that this comment may be interpreted as negatively reflecting on Mark. I like the guy, think he's a pretty good dancer, and any friend of Gilles is a friend of mine. But......
Ok, so I was switching channels tonight, worst TV selection ever, and when I hit the 200's on cable I finally found it, "Iron Chef." I watched this mess for 20 minutes waiting to see the Chairman in his natural habitat, and came away with 2 worthy observations:
1. That is the most boring show I have ever seen on TV. Seriously, it just sucked, and it was weird. Believe it or not, I've been brain dead enough to watch other cooking shows - like that fat lady from Mississippi or wherever - and they were ok.
This deal was frenetic, confusing, little guys sprinting around but still boring me to death, pots boiling over but somebody whispering in the background that this is cool, stay calm, and get this ....At some point the guy in the Chinese silk costume runs out of junk to throw in his pot so he runs 10 feet and there's a complete grocery store on the set! Wow, that seemed to take all of the sport out of it.
2. I never did see the Chairman, perhaps because he is making better money on DWTS, so I guess the whispering in the background during this mayhem fell to the Vice Chairman, but here's the deal: I still don't get it.
Mark is an actor/martial artist. He is not a cook, or so I am told. He "plays" the Chairman on this game show where guys in strange costumes run around, cooking weird stuff they get at the adjacent grocery store, and somebody whispers about how they are doing.
I'll tell you how they're doing: terrible. Their pots are full of random crap pulled off of a fake grocery store shelf, their pretty silk kimonos are stained from sweat and boiling cauldrons, and I have no idea what kind of freak show I'm watching.
But I would like to ask, respectfully, what does the Chairman do if he can't cook? It's a cooking show! Does someone (a real cook) write out his lines in advance? How would they know what insanity will ensue that week?
I really missed the Chairman in his absence since the only thing that would have saved this disaster was some Godzilla monster invading the kitchen and Mark (preferably aided by Gilles) going Kung Fu on the dude.
I am told that martial arts are not a part of the show, no matter how bad the result. That's a mistake.

[VAgirl79]

I have to agree that Donny and Mya's past dancing experiences are two different issues altogether. Donny's dancing in life prior to DWTS is not anywhere near what Mya's is.

I just find the whole Mya thing insulting, particularly this week with the "What do we have to do to please this man?" comment. Way to be respectful to your elder. And I find it even more insulting that the shows makes it seems as if we the viewers are supposed to be outraged at Len for daring to be critical of her. Len's showing backbone about this situation, and I'm glad. I just hope he doesn't cave in for the sake of a storyline, and they suddenly get a 10 from him next week without deserving it. If their dancing warrants it, fine. Still think she has no business being on this show, though.

I would like to apologize in advance to Andie, to the extent that this comment may be interpreted as negatively reflecting on Mark. I like the guy, think he's a pretty good dancer, and any friend of Gilles is a friend of mine. But......
Ok, so I was switching channels tonight, worst TV selection ever, and when I hit the 200's on cable I finally found it, "Iron Chef." I watched this mess for 20 minutes waiting to see the Chairman in his natural habitat, and came away with 2 worthy observations:
1. That is the most boring show I have ever seen on TV. Seriously, it just sucked, and it was weird.

Mark's role as the Chairman on Iron Chef isn't that much of a role. I've only watched it a few times myself because it is pretty painful, but basically he introduces the secret/special ingredient for the challenge [aka the ingredient the recipes have to revolve around], introduces the Iron Chefs (supposedly Master Chefs), and leads the scene where the Challenger chef picks one of the Iron Chefs to compete against. Then I think he pops up again at the end when the judges say who won. Alton Brown (whisper guy, as you put it ) is the host, and he has more of a role than Mark. He's the one yammering away during the actual cooking parts of the show. Only time I've ever found that show interesting was when Rachael Ray and Giada deLaurentis (whose recipes I adore!) competed against each other. Otherwise, yeah, I have about the same reaction to it as you do.

[Peacheater]

****************
All very good points, and you are right.
I wish someone, maybe Peacheater, could tell us which of the dances now featured are really considered "Ballroom dances."
It seems to me that many of the new dances, introduced over the last 2-3 seasons, are fun to watch but not really ballroom - the jive, the two step, the jitterbug, the Lindy hop, the Charleston, hip-hop stuff, etc.
I'm not sure what is pure ballroom, which makes it difficult to say whether someone like Mya is technically disqualified - she is definitely a hip-hop star and expert....so I guess that's not "ballroom" but is prominently featured on the show. Seems like a pretty big loophole.

Everyone in the dance community will have their own opinion on this, sdl. So instead of giving you my personal list for people to dump on, Aaron Carter style, I'd recommend the following wikipedia entry which is rather complete.

Ballroom dance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Wind Dancer]

**********
There you go. Couldn't have said it better myself.
This is exactly the issue....never before has the show crossed this line, but this time they did it in a way that, frankly, I am still struggling to understand. As in, what were they thinking?

I got that exact same feeling during Monday night's show during the pre-dance video of Mya when they had Mya openly discussing how she helped choreograph her own dance.

And had her partner Dmitry saying something like he lets her do that because she knows so much about it and is much happier with the dance when she can do some of the choreography.

My paraphrasing of course. But I thought--Whoa! That's not exactly being very stealthy about her professional dance creds.

Did anyone else pick up on this?

I don't like them shoving it in my face that she's a pro at dancing/choreography.

[Bloomers]

I don't know Donny has been on tv dancing in the Osmond brothers since 1962. The year I was born. The Donny & Marie show was half skits and Dance routines with Donny and Marie. If we are going to split hairs he also performed as a backup dancer in a Weird Al Yankovic video and has also been on stage with Michael Jackson. Donny has decades more time dancing than Mya has on this earth. I don't see either as a ringer.

let not forget Donny's answer to Latoya Jacksons question

"Rumor has it that you've been rehearsing for a year with a private trainer in Utah. Is that true?"

No, that's not true," Donny initially replied.

Donny:

"I will clarify because I have been taking dancing lessons to learn ballroom for the dances that we do in Vegas," he continued, referring to his Las Vegas show with sister Marie, who previously competed on the show. "That's part of the choreography, but it's a whole different thing than what we're doing here."

this sounds like a candidate for the "ringer" to me

Donny as a performer is a showman - a catchall type of performer - a little of this and a little of that. He sings, he tells jokes, he performs skits, he dances....

Mya began as a dancer and has listed herself has a Professional Dancer. At a later point she began her singing career.

She is on the professional par with Dimitry as a choreographer as well as was shown to us in the rehearsal clip the other night when Dimitry himself stated that they share choreographing the routines.

Although other contenders have had dance experience of various kinds, I have never heard of any of them either being labeled as first and primary a Professional Dancer as their career, nor have I heard that on this show they choreographed or took the lead in any way from the pro in the dances.

Therefore, Mya unlike anyone else that we know of on the show is on a professional level with the pros on this show.

One further thing that I take into consideration with Mya is that her considerable tap and especially jazz experience is going to catapult her right into all of the Latin dances. The tap will give her ease of foot work, and the jazz will give her the hip and body movement.

Donny, on the other hand, should be able to take his experience and parlay it into softshoe fairly easily ( Charleston). The others will be harder, and his age is going to of a necessity be a factor as well.

[Wind Dancer]

I would like to apologize in advance to Andie, to the extent that this comment may be interpreted as negatively reflecting on Mark. I like the guy, think he's a pretty good dancer, and any friend of Gilles is a friend of mine. But......
Ok, so I was switching channels tonight, worst TV selection ever, and when I hit the 200's on cable I finally found it, "Iron Chef." I watched this mess for 20 minutes waiting to see the Chairman in his natural habitat, and came away with 2 worthy observations:
1. That is the most boring show I have ever seen on TV. Seriously, it just sucked, and it was weird. Believe it or not, I've been brain dead enough to watch other cooking shows - like that fat lady from Mississippi or wherever - and they were ok.
This deal was frenetic, confusing, little guys sprinting around but still boring me to death, pots boiling over but somebody whispering in the background that this is cool, stay calm, and get this ....At some point the guy in the Chinese silk costume runs out of junk to throw in his pot so he runs 10 feet and there's a complete grocery store on the set! Wow, that seemed to take all of the sport out of it.
2. I never did see the Chairman, perhaps because he is making better money on DWTS, so I guess the whispering in the background during this mayhem fell to the Vice Chairman, but here's the deal: I still don't get it.
Mark is an actor/martial artist. He is not a cook, or so I am told. He "plays" the Chairman on this game show where guys in strange costumes run around, cooking weird stuff they get at the adjacent grocery store, and somebody whispers about how they are doing.
I'll tell you how they're doing: terrible. Their pots are full of random crap pulled off of a fake grocery store shelf, their pretty silk kimonos are stained from sweat and boiling cauldrons, and I have no idea what kind of freak show I'm watching.
But I would like to ask, respectfully, what does the Chairman do if he can't cook? It's a cooking show! Does someone (a real cook) write out his lines in advance? How would they know what insanity will ensue that week?
I really missed the Chairman in his absence since the only thing that would have saved this disaster was some Godzilla monster invading the kitchen and Mark (preferably aided by Gilles) going Kung Fu on the dude.
I am told that martial arts are not a part of the show, no matter how bad the result. That's a mistake.

SDL--thanks so much for this! it made me laugh so hard on a day when I needed that.

I've never seen the show (I don't have cable--if I did I wouldn't get any of my work done) but now I know I don't have to wonder about seeing it. I've got your great visuals in my head.

[Rattus]

It's more enjoyable for me to watch Kelly, Natalie, Louie, and Mark because they're completely out of their comfort zone and learning a new skill and it's still obvious all 4 weeks in they have a ways to go.

Me too. What I primarily enjoy about this show is watching neophytes starting out like uncertain young fawn and ending as almost indistinguishable from the pros, with maybe a little goofiness (not too much, though - I'm looking at you Donny) along the way. If I wanted to watch professional ballroom pairs, I would watch a professional ballroom show.

[Shoepie]

sdl, hysterical! I feel the same way about Iron Chef and cooking is a creative hobby of mine!

This show has never been more than entertainment and a popularity contest. I accepted this out of the gate. Since ballroom dancing bores me I appreciate the addition of some new routines. I generally watch this heavy on the FF button. I am interested to see how far Kelly and often just watch her dance.