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  1. #6851
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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    As for Diana bringing in new blood....same as with any bride marrying into the family, really. It's not like she was a "commoner" like Kate.
    The Spencers are an old aristocratic family with associations to royalty for centuries. Their line can be traced to James II and Charles I, and all the way back to William the Conqueror. Diana's family owned property next to the Queen's palace in Sandringham and as a girl she played with Princes Andrew and Edward. Diana's father was equerry to both QEII and her father, and her maternal grandmother (Lady Fermoy) was lady in waiting and close friend of the Queen Mother. It's said that Lady Fermoy and the Queen Mother were responsible for getting Charles and Diana together and encouraging the marriage. As far as the royal family was concerned, Diana had the perfect pedigree to become the wife of the heir.

    It's William's wife, Kate, who as a commoner is bringing new blood to the royal family.

    Harry may have been the same person he is today if his mother had lived, but I do wonder if her influence could have made a difference.

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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    Quote Originally Posted by MizDaisy View Post
    The Spencers are an old aristocratic family with associations to royalty for centuries. Their line can be traced to James II and Charles I, and all the way back to William the Conqueror. Diana's family owned property next to the Queen's palace in Sandringham and as a girl she played with Princes Andrew and Edward. Diana's father was equerry to both QEII and her father, and her maternal grandmother (Lady Fermoy) was lady in waiting and close friend of the Queen Mother. It's said that Lady Fermoy and the Queen Mother were responsible for getting Charles and Diana together and encouraging the marriage. As far as the royal family was concerned, Diana had the perfect pedigree to become the wife of the heir.

    It's William's wife, Kate, who as a commoner is bringing new blood to the royal family.

    Harry may have been the same person he is today if his mother had lived, but I do wonder if her influence could have made a difference.
    Miz Daisy, I absolutely agree that from the standpoint of aristocratic blood, looking at Diana vs. Kate, clearly Kate is the commoner, Diana was not.

    However, as far as bringing new blood into the royal family, Diana did in HER way, as well. I think she did in the sense that once she came along, she shook the foundations of the royal family to its roots in terms of personality, warmth, caring, being approachable. Being willing to approach those of "lesser" social status and aristocratic rank. Frankly, at this point, I don't recall the BRF ever being really consistently known for ANY of those qualities prior to the advent of Diana.

    We've all seen pictures of her on "walkabouts", crouching down to talk to children, the elderly, etc., holding babies, shaking hands with AIDS patients, and so on. After her boys were born, we saw pictures of her with her arms wide and a huge smile on her face (you could practically see her molars!) as they ran to her when she returned from trips. We've heard stories of how she'd take her boys to McDonald's and make them wait on line like everybody else, so they'd understand as much as possible that everybody in the world wasn't born into the status they were born into, and that this was what people in the real world did everyday.

    So, I think, in her own way (nobly born or not), Diana DID bring new blood into the BRF.

    That's how I see it, and it's just another angle on the subject, I think.

    And yes, with the Vegas events, I've wondered if Diana being around might've had some influence on the choices Harry made. And I agree, maybe, maybe not.

    Obviously, we'll never know.

    And that's sad.
    Last edited by ness; 09-02-2012 at 01:36 PM.
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  3. #6853
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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    [Diana] shook the foundations of the royal family to its roots in terms of personality, warmth, caring, being approachable. Being willing to approach those of "lesser" social status and aristocratic rank. Frankly, at this point, I don't recall the BRF ever being really consistently known for ANY of those qualities prior to the advent of Diana.
    Diana received a lot of attention for her charitable work in and outside of GB, and her ability to interact with a variety of people worldwide, but she was certainly not the only royal in modern times to earn the love and respect of the people. During WWII, QEII's parents, King George VI and Elizabeth, endeared themselves to the public by visiting the devastated areas that were bombed to interact with the people, offering comfort and encouragement to endure the deprivations of the war. The king and his family could have been evacuated to a safer area but chose to stay, and were subject to the same rationing of food, water, fuel, etc. as everyone else. QEII also famously drove an ambulance during the war. QEII's great uncle, Edward VIII was also very popular with the people before he became king, touring and meeting with people in poverty stricken areas of the country and bringing attention to their needs at a time when little was being done to help them. His participation in WWI, interacting with soldiers, made him very popular with veterans.

    While Diana didn't literally bring new blood to the royal family, as Kate has done, I think what she did bring that was new and different was the way she chose to raise her children. Unlike the traditional insular upbringing that had been SOP for the monarch's children, especially the heir, she broke the mold by exposing her children to the "real world" from an early age, allowing them to experience things that had been unheard of until then, from visiting amusement parks, charities for the poor, to William spending time in a camp in Chile where photos show that among other manual labor, he cleaned toilets. To this day, it's reported William and Kate prefer to take care of their own domestic duties, including cleaning toilets. Such "common" behavior would have been unheard of for an heir to the throne before now.

    I think Diana understood before the other royals that in order for the monarchy to survive in modern times, the people had to see the future king living among them, not distant and separate, and despite Harry's recent behavior, I think she would be proud to see that she achieved her goal in the men they have become.

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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    Quote Originally Posted by MizDaisy View Post
    Diana received a lot of attention for her charitable work in and outside of GB, and her ability to interact with a variety of people worldwide, but she was certainly not the only royal in modern times to earn the love and respect of the people. During WWII, QEII's parents, King George VI and Elizabeth, endeared themselves to the public by visiting the devastated areas that were bombed to interact with the people, offering comfort and encouragement to endure the deprivations of the war. The king and his family could have been evacuated to a safer area but chose to stay, and were subject to the same rationing of food, water, fuel, etc. as everyone else. QEII also famously drove an ambulance during the war. QEII's great uncle, Edward VIII was also very popular with the people before he became king, touring and meeting with people in poverty stricken areas of the country and bringing attention to their needs at a time when little was being done to help them. His participation in WWI, interacting with soldiers, made him very popular with veterans.

    While Diana didn't literally bring new blood to the royal family, as Kate has done, I think what she did bring that was new and different was the way she chose to raise her children. Unlike the traditional insular upbringing that had been SOP for the monarch's children, especially the heir, she broke the mold by exposing her children to the "real world" from an early age, allowing them to experience things that had been unheard of until then, from visiting amusement parks, charities for the poor, to William spending time in a camp in Chile where photos show that among other manual labor, he cleaned toilets. To this day, it's reported William and Kate prefer to take care of their own domestic duties, including cleaning toilets. Such "common" behavior would have been unheard of for an heir to the throne before now.

    I think Diana understood before the other royals that in order for the monarchy to survive in modern times, the people had to see the future king living among them, not distant and separate, and despite Harry's recent behavior, I think she would be proud to see that she achieved her goal in the men they have become.
    Oh, sure, QEII's parents endeared themselves to the British during the war. Matter of fact, I remember reading one quote from Queen Elizabeth's mother wherein she (paraphrasing) said that since the Palace had been bombed, she now felt as though she could look the East End in the face. As well as another quote, wherein she was asked why the royal family DIDN'T move themselves to safer quarters. Paraphrasing: "The King will not go. I will not go without the King. And the children will not go without me."

    And yep, the present monarch DID drive an ambulance during the war. Actually, her training was so thorough that, to this very day, she is said of being capable of taking an automobile engine apart, and putting it back together, because of that training she'd received.

    Something that I SURE cannot do!

    I did touch on/mention Diana's style as she performed her charity work, which was a style that, not to negate the actions of QEII's parents, DID blow through the country and land her on newspapers from one end of the globe to the other. Diana took it to another, bigger level than even THEY did, I think.

    And I did mention her parenting style, which WAS unique to British royalty at the time. Sure, she took them to amusement parks (I remember one famous shot where she's sitting --- wet --- in a raft/inner-tube-looking contraption in a water park with William and Harry, and laughing her head off, having fun with them). Additionally, when William had gotten beaned in the head with a golf club one time (he still has the scar, I think), I remember seeing a picture of her in the hospital, chewing away at her nails in worry. Charles, OTOH, went to a previously-scheduled appearance that night.

    Also, she was known to be down-to-earth with dealing with household staff, too. I remember reading one story about her having a habit of walking into the Clarence House and/or Palace kitchens, hopping up on a counter and chatting merrily away with the kitchen staff as they worked. This threw the staff for a loop, as no other royal prior to her had ever done such a thing. This would have been during the period after she became formally engaged and was living at Clarence House. Who knows, but from what I understand, she was pulled aside and told that this was not proper for her to do by TPTB in the Palace.

    So, yeah, in her own way and style --- through parenting her children AND working for and with various charities, and even dealing with household staff, apparently --- Diana brought new blood into the BRF, too.

    And I absolutely agree that she was way, WAY ahead of her time in understanding that:

    . . . in order for the monarchy to survive in modern times, the people had to see the future king living among them, not distant and separate, and despite Harry's recent behavior, I think she would be proud to see that she achieved her goal in the men they have become.
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  5. #6855
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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    I did touch on/mention Diana's style as she performed her charity work, which was a style that, not to negate the actions of QEII's parents, DID blow through the country and land her on newspapers from one end of the globe to the other. Diana took it to another, bigger level than even THEY did, I think.
    Diana certainly made her own unique contributions, but I wouldn't say they were any greater because I think it was the media that took it to another level. Diana was glamorous, personable, and relentlessly scrutinized by the media so of course it would appear that everything she did was more, bigger, better than any other royal had ever done. She was actually performing the same kinds of activities and charitable work other members of the royal family had been doing long before she married Charles. But the media pursued Diana because the public had an insatiable appetite for any news, photos, stories about her. All of the media coverage made her seem more real, more accessible than any other royal had ever been to the public. And while there was some resentment from Charles and other members of the family because their efforts had received nowhere near the attention Diana received, they also knew that Diana's rock star level of fame was a huge boost to the monarchy. A boost that carries on with her children.
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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    Quote Originally Posted by MizDaisy View Post
    Diana certainly made her own unique contributions, but I wouldn't say they were any greater because I think it was the media that took it to another level. Diana was glamorous, personable, and relentlessly scrutinized by the media so of course it would appear that everything she did was more, bigger, better than any other royal had ever done. She was actually performing the same kinds of activities and charitable work other members of the royal family had been doing long before she married Charles. But the media pursued Diana because the public had an insatiable appetite for any news, photos, stories about her. All of the media coverage made her seem more real, more accessible than any other royal had ever been to the public. And while there was some resentment from Charles and other members of the family because their efforts had received nowhere near the attention Diana received, they also knew that Diana's rock star level of fame was a huge boost to the monarchy. A boost that carries on with her children.
    Gotcha.

    And I think you're right.

    The media created the "Superstar Princess", and the "Superstar Princess" took that, ran with it and used it to her advantage. Just as Diana was savvy enough to understand that the public had to see the future monarch as "one of them", I think she was also savvy enough to use the media to her advantage when it came to promoting her charities, etc.

    I mean, how many celebrities have we heard say, in some fashion, at some point: "Well, since I'm stuck with being a "public" person because of what it is that I happen to do for a living, I thought: 'Why not use that to bring attention to (fill in the blank)?'"

    Problem is, to do so turned out to be a MONSTER of a double-edged sword, in Diana's case. A faucet that couldn't be turned off at will. The media (it can be said) created and used her, and she straight-up used THEM in return. But, ultimately, she didn't have any control over them in terms of being able to say "Stop!" and close the door on them when SHE wanted to, I think. By being used and using in return, she inadvertently struck a lifelong deal with the Devil.

    I had to giggle when you remarked about resentment from Charles and the other members of the family. Too true. Even while they WERE aware that Diana's rock-star popularity boosted the monarchy, they resented it and were jealous of her for it, too. They'd been toiling in the "good works" vineyards for YEARS, and along comes this "upstart" who'd done nothing more but presented a shy (at first, at least) demeanor and a set of doe eyes to die for, and she blew them off the map.

    I remember reading one funny story about how C&D were doing a joint appearance. People basically damn near caused a stampede trying to get to Diana, while Charles was pretty much left to converse with the air around him. One reporter happened to catch a remark Charles made, when somebody asked him about Diana. Said remark was something to the effect of: "Well, she's right over THERE! After all, I'M just the heir!"

    I cracked up.

    Whatever the genesis for Diana's enormous popularity and worldwide mover-and-shaker status, aristocratic blood or not, there was also, I think, a "real", "normal" person in there that lives on in William and Harry, too.
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  7. #6857
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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    The media (it can be said) created and used her, and she straight-up used THEM in return. But, ultimately, she didn't have any control over them in terms of being able to say "Stop!" and close the door on them when SHE wanted to, I think. By being used and using in return, she inadvertently struck a lifelong deal with the Devil.
    ITA, and it's been said that her deal with the devil is what ultimately cost her life. What a terrible price to pay: not only her life, but the impact of her loss on the lives of her young sons. Both of them dealing with the end of their parents' marriage, and then to lose their mother -- I can't even imagine what that did to them. They obviously got through it as well as anyone could have hoped, although I still wonder if things would be different for Harry if she had lived. I remember seeing pictures of him as a boy and thinking, that one's going to be a handful someday. He always had a gleam of mischief about him, so I think he would have pushed the limits regardless, but maybe a little less so if his mother had been there.
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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    Quote Originally Posted by MizDaisy View Post
    ITA, and it's been said that her deal with the devil is what ultimately cost her life. What a terrible price to pay: not only her life, but the impact of her loss on the lives of her young sons. Both of them dealing with the end of their parents' marriage, and then to lose their mother -- I can't even imagine what that did to them. They obviously got through it as well as anyone could have hoped, although I still wonder if things would be different for Harry if she had lived. I remember seeing pictures of him as a boy and thinking, that one's going to be a handful someday. He always had a gleam of mischief about him, so I think he would have pushed the limits regardless, but maybe a little less so if his mother had been there.
    Yeah.

    It's so sad, because we'll always be left to wonder "What if?" about what Diana's influence on Harry might've been during his manhood.

    Sad.
    Last edited by ness; 09-03-2012 at 04:21 PM.
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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    Amy Poehler and Will Arnett just announced that they are divorcing:
    Amy Poehler, Will Arnett Separate : People.com

    I read a blind item about a week ago that sounded like them, but I was hoping it wasn't true. I love them. Sad for their sons.
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    Re: Miscellaneous Celebrity News

    Quote Originally Posted by Critical View Post
    Amy Poehler and Will Arnett just announced that they are divorcing:
    Amy Poehler, Will Arnett Separate : People.com

    I read a blind item about a week ago that sounded like them, but I was hoping it wasn't true. I love them. Sad for their sons.
    That is too bad.
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