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Thread: Boy Meets Boy Final Thought

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by tubey
    ...In his closing V/O he said that "he wouldn't be categorized"; which may be his way of saying that he's keeping his (sexual) options open; hardly the first one to do that; after all, despite what our conservative "friends" may say, life is very much full of gray areas, and not black and white;

    Matt has already stated elsewhere that Franklin (or John, as his name may turn out to be) was under the same stringent contractual rules re-garding "backing out" or walking away; however, that makes me question Matt's very candid "I want off" as played in the opening moments of episode 6; what's the difference? It would be interesting if Matt or one of the other mates went through the "rules" with us.

    Right now he's getting mightily castigated by many, but is that really fair? Without knowing about "the rules" and, indeed, living in his skin for those final days, we probably will never understand fully what he was feeling. I'm not willing to write him off as a mercenary on a two-fold mission.

    Just my .02.
    People's motives for their actions and ways of thinking are never that easy to suss out in one go, are they? I agree, there's an interesting back story coming from all the straight guys on this show...

    * what they were told by the producers/ how the show was 'pitched' to them

    * their own life experiences with the idea of homosexuality (they got mistaken for gay many times, family/friends have not been tolerant of homosexuality, they have had an epiphany of sorts and have recently determined to embrace the existence of a gay culture, etc)

    * desire for acting opportunities, the fun of being on tv for their 15 minutes of fame

    * curiosity about how the 'other half' lives; challenging themselves to venture out of their own comfort zone

    * and most interesting -- how they changed how they saw their own role in the game as the week went on... did they come in feeling positive about their roles only to find they really are uncomfortable, did they come in feeling uncomfortable only to find they were very comfortable, did they change the way they saw themselves?

    and so on.

    I was surprised by matt's blunt declaration too. I think he ultimately did a good thing, b/c it allowed the show an aspect of integrity that you don't see on other reality shows, where people will fake it to stay in the game. I was a bit miffed that he was a little cold about it (in fact, he was a pretty cool character while he was there), but I guess it was an uncomfortable situation anyway, so his candor was probably the only way. Despite his declaration, James could have still kept him -- if James was a different type of person... But you're right, it's sort of a loophole in the 'no walking away' policy.

    As for Franklin's last few days... it's a difficult situation. Having gone that far in any lie, I think I would feel painted into a corner... my fear of being 'found out' would become greater than any promise to myself to 'be truthful'... Yes, it's a weakness, and in a perfect world I would want to be different person, but.... sigh! it's hard to judge someone when you haven't seen all the footage and haven't been in his shoes.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by foody
    People's motives for their actions and ways of thinking are never that easy to suss out in one go, are they? I agree, there's an interesting back story coming from all the straight guys on this show...

    * what they were told by the producers/ how the show was 'pitched' to them

    * their own life experiences with the idea of homosexuality (they got mistaken for gay many times, family/friends have not been tolerant of homosexuality, they have had an epiphany of sorts and have recently determined to embrace the existence of a gay culture, etc)

    * desire for acting opportunities, the fun of being on tv for their 15 minutes of fame

    * curiosity about how the 'other half' lives; challenging themselves to venture out of their own comfort zone

    * and most interesting -- how they changed how they saw their own role in the game as the week went on... did they come in feeling positive about their roles only to find they really are uncomfortable, did they come in feeling uncomfortable only to find they were very comfortable, did they change the way they saw themselves?

    and so on.

    I was surprised by matt's blunt declaration too. I think he ultimately did a good thing, b/c it allowed the show an aspect of integrity that you don't see on other reality shows, where people will fake it to stay in the game. I was a bit miffed that he was a little cold about it (in fact, he was a pretty cool character while he was there), but I guess it was an uncomfortable situation anyway, so his candor was probably the only way. Despite his declaration, James could have still kept him -- if James was a different type of person... But you're right, it's sort of a loophole in the 'no walking away' policy.

    As for Franklin's last few days... it's a difficult situation. Having gone that far in any lie, I think I would feel painted into a corner... my fear of being 'found out' would become greater than any promise to myself to 'be truthful'... Yes, it's a weakness, and in a perfect world I would want to be different person, but.... sigh! it's hard to judge someone when you haven't seen all the footage and haven't been in his shoes.
    Just a comment and my opinion for what its worth.

    On the Yahoo group moderated by Matt he states that he never said "I don't want to be here--that it is deliberate false editing by the producers that he dosen't understand.

    On the whole show process--If the confrontation/revolt (whatever you want to call it) that took place between the gay mates and the producers after they found out about the twist had not occured I do believe that this show would have been more like "Temptaton Island" or "Paradise Hotel" than what ended up on the air. Take Dan as an example--he was on LOST on NBC--another reality TV show and rather than do a stunt in drag he quit and left the show. Here we see him going so far as to shove his naked butt against the door of the shower. The difference being LOST was similar to Amazing Race--i.e. Dan was being himself. Here he was pretending to be gay and trying to win 25,00.00. And I am of the opinion that the straight mates went much further in expressing an interest in James and trying to win the game, then we ever saw on the air. That is why you have such unusual editing etc. throughout the show. And that is why in my opinion James is still so upset about the whole enterprise and why some segments of the gay community were so angry about this show before it ever aired. And I realize that is all it is my opinion--maybe right, maybe wrong. But far closer to the truth than anyone will ever admit I dare say.

    Seth

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by sethy11
    ....And that is why in my opinion James is still so upset about the whole enterprise and why some segments of the gay community were so angry about this show before it ever aired. And I realize that is all it is my opinion--maybe right, maybe wrong. But far closer to the truth than anyone will ever admit I dare say.

    Seth
    hey seth, it's great to find a new post from you here. i figured everyone left for good, or transferred to the yahoo site (personally I like the 'organization' of this layout -- yeah, call me anal ;p) Anyway, what you say is interesting. It's difficult to sort out the various bits of info we're getting, both from the show and from the interviews and participant posts in the post-show period. I have to say I'm more than a little confused. I am glad I thought to look for a forum/board at all, since it's given a great depth to the experience of seeing this new type of show unfold over the weeks.

    I'm not sure which segment everyone else is referring to, but I think I remember a scene where Matt did say "I want out; is that clear enough for you?" to James. Is that what you're talking about? It could have been edited and chopped up, true, and it wasn't included in the ep4 segment, but was thrown in in the last ep (which was an interesting choice for the editors to make).

    As for what the motivations of people were -- well, that's a huge question mark. Even my own motivations for watching are nebulous at best... I thought, hey, this is great, they're showing something which will have gay men as real people with dating woes and feelings -- nothing too serious but good to have out there nonetheless. They chose this very up-standing guy as lead, and his dedicated friend. I was a little ticked by the twist idea, but thought maybe it would ultimately have more people watch. By the latter half, I was distraught for James and was hoping they'd tell him about the twist sooner rather than later if at all. I bit my nails through the morning-of scenes, and was intrigued by the James/Andra deliberations. And in the end, I'm glad I watched, but since I'm not sure exactly WHAT I watched (b/c of all the editing) I have to take that ambiguity into consideration.

    For all that, I'm puzzled by Dan's continuing friendship with Brian, and even when I saw a photo of Andra on Dan's lap. I guess everyone has their 'take' on the experience and other people's behavior, and only they will know what really happened. Everything we see in media has to be taken with a grain of salt, and since this is a show with 'real' people, I will keep in mind what you said. Ultimately I am ok with how the show was presented -- I think it would have turned my stomach too much if I'd seen all the not-shown bits you hint at. I'm cynical enough as it is!

  4. #24
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    I was surprized to find out that both James and Wes are Cancers. They
    seem so totally different. To re-phrase one of the earlier posts on this
    thread--something to the effect of James being BORING--my take is
    that Wes is probably really hot in bed, and James is very unimaginative
    and conservative. Remember, when he was talking about how important
    kissing is, and that, after all, once you're in a relationship you're going
    to be kissing the person a lot more than having sex. Well, maybe after
    a few years!
    I'd think hot sex should be a priority at the offset! KEN

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by realKen
    I was surprized to find out that both James and Wes are Cancers. They
    seem so totally different. To re-phrase one of the earlier posts on this
    thread--something to the effect of James being BORING--my take is
    that Wes is probably really hot in bed, and James is very unimaginative
    and conservative. Remember, when he was talking about how important
    kissing is, and that, after all, once you're in a relationship you're going
    to be kissing the person a lot more than having sex. Well, maybe after
    a few years!
    I'd think hot sex should be a priority at the offset! KEN
    Actually, that's one of the few t hings I'm in complete agreement with James on.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lolasdad
    Actually, that's one of the few t hings I'm in complete agreement with James on.
    Well, good sex involves good kissing, doesn't it? I mentioned this in
    another post somewhere...when James & Franklin were changing for
    their massage, James had his back to Franklin. I just found it odd that
    James was not making eye contact then, as well as checking out
    Franklin's bod in more detail. KEN

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