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  1. #21
    FORT Regular Roddick_Rulez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orinos
    God, why do so many people put such stock into a kiss.
    Don't get me wrong, kiss is great, but it's not a good way to tell someone's sexuality. As gay men, we should know this. How many of you gay men, while still in the closet, kissed a woman passionately? I bet none of them said, "Gee, you kiss like a queer." Kissing is easy, anyone can do it, so don't read into it. Contrary to what the song says, it's not all in his kiss: It's in his unprovoked touching.
    Before I go on to explaining myself, I want to root Brian out of this first. Incase there is any doubt about Brian, let me just clear something up: He's gay. There is no doubt about that. If you read his bio provided by Bravo, you can see it there between the lines. "Shirtless bartender?" Speaking as a bartender, there are only two types of bars that I can think of that would use a bare-chested bartender. Gay and one catering exclusively to straight women. I don't see a bar that caters only to straight womem as being very profitable since most straight women I know do go out JUST to hang out with other women, (remember, I said STRAIGHT women.) I've never heard of such a bar, so I doubt there are many, if any, of them. Furthermore, Brain admitted early on that he also was developing a crush on Dan. If he was one of the straight ones, his whole purpose for being on the show is to win the money. Admitting to like someone else other then James isn't a smart move since, if it got back to James, would more then likely ruin his chances. So what he said about Dan must have been true, ergo, he's gay.
    So that leaves Wes and Franklin.
    The mass majority of you guys seem to think that Franklin is the straight one, but I just don't know. I think he's gay; infact, I'm pretty sure he is.
    Whoever is the straight "mate" has to realize, at this point, that he's gonna have to kiss James at one point. And this "straight mate" is, without a doubt, a great actor. So kissing, should be discounted as the "test" to which to hold these guys to since they have all thought about it and have prepared themselves.
    The fact that Franklin is the only one who hasn't kissed James means nothing. I, as a gay man, don't kiss someone right away. I like to wait around a week before I kiss someone I've been dating. All this means is that is that Franklin is old-fashioned. He is reserved, apprehensive and modest. Believe it or not, there are gay men out there like that.
    But as I said earlier, it's in the unprovoked touching. Wes just seems like an actor to me. Everything seems so well thought out, so prefect and rehearsed. When you look at him and his actions, on the whole, he certainly seems gay and sincere about his actraction to James.....but it seems so overt with no underlying details to back up his attraction. His Flirting, kissing and touching seem so obvious. They scream to be noticed without any intimacy. There appears to be no unconcious messages being sent by Wes, as everything he does is certainly on the fore-front of his mind.
    Franklin, on the other hand, is very different. It's the overt actions that he seems concious of and tries to restrain.
    On the last episode, when Franklin and James were coming back from the spa, did anyone notice how Franklin was sitting in the car as compared to his other times with James? He appeared to be more open, more at ease and more "come heither." This is a progressive attitude of attraction that is not easy to fake. It doesn't show someone slowing forcing themselves foward, but rather someone slowly opening up and slowing letting down the restraints. Restraints that Wes never showed.
    But more importantly, something else happened there in the car that was so subtle, so unobtrusive that it had to be genuine. Franklin rubbed the knuckle of his left hand up against the side of James' knee. It was an unconcious, comfortable show of attraction. It was something that an actor couldn't have thought of doing on improptu. And definately so much on the sly that no attention was brought to it that it escaped the camera man, the producers and even (the dunce) James himself. An actor would have been so proud of himself if he HAD managed to think up this wonderful way of sending a message of attraction, he would have waited for the right moment to do it so it WOULD be noticed, therefor making it not subtle at all.

    People, remember the underlying tenets of gaydar:
    1) it's not WHAT he does, it's what he DOESN'T do.
    2) It's all in the details, not what's in the "big picture."
    Excellent Excellent post...I totally agree with it all...Franklin was quite genuine in his time with James, that it would be so hard to believe that he was acting...The way he was intimate with James by rubbing his hand on James' knee was a definite show of attraction on Franklin's part.

    Wes seemed very much like an actor to me...and I agree totally with your evaluation...But Andra and James seem to have no clue. Andra even said that Wes had to be 100% gay...

    I'm still sticking to my guns and saying that Brian wins next week...


    .: Estella and Bob found love on The Bachelor! :.
    .: Ryan O. will mount an upset on Survivor: Pearl Islands :.
    .: Brian H. did not find love on Boy Meets Boy :.
    .: Dawn Marie did not win 1 million dollars on The Family :.
    .: Kelly and Jon did NOT win TAR :.
    .: Congrats to Reichen and Chip! :.
    .: Rocco DiSpirito will be fired from Rocco's :.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orinos
    God, why do so many people put such stock into a kiss.
    Don't get me wrong, kiss is great, but it's not a good way to tell someone's sexuality. As gay men, we should know this. How many of you gay men, while still in the closet, kissed a woman passionately? I bet none of them said, "Gee, you kiss like a queer." Kissing is easy, anyone can do it, so don't read into it. Contrary to what the song says, it's not all in his kiss: It's in his unprovoked touching.
    Before I go on to explaining myself, I want to root Brian out of this first. Incase there is any doubt about Brian, let me just clear something up: He's gay. There is no doubt about that. If you read his bio provided by Bravo, you can see it there between the lines. "Shirtless bartender?" Speaking as a bartender, there are only two types of bars that I can think of that would use a bare-chested bartender. Gay and one catering exclusively to straight women. I don't see a bar that caters only to straight womem as being very profitable since most straight women I know do go out JUST to hang out with other women, (remember, I said STRAIGHT women.) I've never heard of such a bar, so I doubt there are many, if any, of them. Furthermore, Brain admitted early on that he also was developing a crush on Dan. If he was one of the straight ones, his whole purpose for being on the show is to win the money. Admitting to like someone else other then James isn't a smart move since, if it got back to James, would more then likely ruin his chances. So what he said about Dan must have been true, ergo, he's gay.
    So that leaves Wes and Franklin.
    The mass majority of you guys seem to think that Franklin is the straight one, but I just don't know. I think he's gay; infact, I'm pretty sure he is.
    Whoever is the straight "mate" has to realize, at this point, that he's gonna have to kiss James at one point. And this "straight mate" is, without a doubt, a great actor. So kissing, should be discounted as the "test" to which to hold these guys to since they have all thought about it and have prepared themselves.
    The fact that Franklin is the only one who hasn't kissed James means nothing. I, as a gay man, don't kiss someone right away. I like to wait around a week before I kiss someone I've been dating. All this means is that is that Franklin is old-fashioned. He is reserved, apprehensive and modest. Believe it or not, there are gay men out there like that.
    But as I said earlier, it's in the unprovoked touching. Wes just seems like an actor to me. Everything seems so well thought out, so prefect and rehearsed. When you look at him and his actions, on the whole, he certainly seems gay and sincere about his actraction to James.....but it seems so overt with no underlying details to back up his attraction. His Flirting, kissing and touching seem so obvious. They scream to be noticed without any intimacy. There appears to be no unconcious messages being sent by Wes, as everything he does is certainly on the fore-front of his mind.
    Franklin, on the other hand, is very different. It's the overt actions that he seems concious of and tries to restrain.
    On the last episode, when Franklin and James were coming back from the spa, did anyone notice how Franklin was sitting in the car as compared to his other times with James? He appeared to be more open, more at ease and more "come heither." This is a progressive attitude of attraction that is not easy to fake. It doesn't show someone slowing forcing themselves foward, but rather someone slowly opening up and slowing letting down the restraints. Restraints that Wes never showed.
    But more importantly, something else happened there in the car that was so subtle, so unobtrusive that it had to be genuine. Franklin rubbed the knuckle of his left hand up against the side of James' knee. It was an unconcious, comfortable show of attraction. It was something that an actor couldn't have thought of doing on improptu. And definately so much on the sly that no attention was brought to it that it escaped the camera man, the producers and even (the dunce) James himself. An actor would have been so proud of himself if he HAD managed to think up this wonderful way of sending a message of attraction, he would have waited for the right moment to do it so it WOULD be noticed, therefor making it not subtle at all.

    People, remember the underlying tenets of gaydar:
    1) it's not WHAT he does, it's what he DOESN'T do.
    2) It's all in the details, not what's in the "big picture."

    Well said Orinos. I totally agree. Wes seems like an actor. He's always on. It's irritating. No wonder he's a fundraiser. He knows how to work people.

    As for Franklin, he seems quite genuine in his conversation and his actions. The knee rubbing was really sweet.

    I also want to agree with James' assessment at one point regarding Franklin. He's the most "Straight-acting". Wouldn't he gay it up a bit if he were trying to win the 25K.

  3. #23
    FORT Regular corgi's Avatar
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    Hi all, I'm new (bows)

    Brian seems like the ultra-shy "stay-away-from-me" type which is completely opposite what James wants. I'm surprised he is in the "finals"

    T

  4. #24
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    shirtless bartending and public kisses

    Brian cannot be ruled out as the straight mate simply because he works in a gay bar as a shirtless bartender. Lots of straight boys with nice bodies hold jobs in gay bars because the tips are better than at straight bars (I know this is a genaralization so, in advance, shut up.).
    On to the kissing - I agree that the kisses mean less than nothing.
    First of all, the mates were told no open mouth kissing was allowed. Some of them may have taken that to mean they had best stick to polite pecks.
    The other thing with the kissing - as a long time kisser of boys, I have to say that I, like most other gay men, have subconsciously trained myself to never make physical displays of affection in public. I think an aversion to kissing in this situation has more to do with the camera and less to do with not wanting to kiss James.

  5. #25
    FORT Fogey eldee's Avatar
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    Monkey Boy, I don't think there should be any problem with James kissing the guy(s), but he isn't really dating any of them yet. From the one interview I read, it did not go well.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orinos
    God, why do so many people put such stock into a kiss.
    Don't get me wrong, kiss is great, but it's not a good way to tell someone's sexuality. As gay men, we should know this. How many of you gay men, while still in the closet, kissed a woman passionately? I bet none of them said, "Gee, you kiss like a queer." Kissing is easy, anyone can do it, so don't read into it. Contrary to what the song says, it's not all in his kiss: It's in his unprovoked touching.
    Before I go on to explaining myself, I want to root Brian out of this first. Incase there is any doubt about Brian, let me just clear something up: He's gay. There is no doubt about that. If you read his bio provided by Bravo, you can see it there between the lines. "Shirtless bartender?" Speaking as a bartender, there are only two types of bars that I can think of that would use a bare-chested bartender. Gay and one catering exclusively to straight women. I don't see a bar that caters only to straight womem as being very profitable since most straight women I know do go out JUST to hang out with other women, (remember, I said STRAIGHT women.) I've never heard of such a bar, so I doubt there are many, if any, of them. Furthermore, Brain admitted early on that he also was developing a crush on Dan. If he was one of the straight ones, his whole purpose for being on the show is to win the money. Admitting to like someone else other then James isn't a smart move since, if it got back to James, would more then likely ruin his chances. So what he said about Dan must have been true, ergo, he's gay.
    So that leaves Wes and Franklin.
    The mass majority of you guys seem to think that Franklin is the straight one, but I just don't know. I think he's gay; infact, I'm pretty sure he is.
    Whoever is the straight "mate" has to realize, at this point, that he's gonna have to kiss James at one point. And this "straight mate" is, without a doubt, a great actor. So kissing, should be discounted as the "test" to which to hold these guys to since they have all thought about it and have prepared themselves.
    The fact that Franklin is the only one who hasn't kissed James means nothing. I, as a gay man, don't kiss someone right away. I like to wait around a week before I kiss someone I've been dating. All this means is that is that Franklin is old-fashioned. He is reserved, apprehensive and modest. Believe it or not, there are gay men out there like that.
    But as I said earlier, it's in the unprovoked touching. Wes just seems like an actor to me. Everything seems so well thought out, so prefect and rehearsed. When you look at him and his actions, on the whole, he certainly seems gay and sincere about his actraction to James.....but it seems so overt with no underlying details to back up his attraction. His Flirting, kissing and touching seem so obvious. They scream to be noticed without any intimacy. There appears to be no unconcious messages being sent by Wes, as everything he does is certainly on the fore-front of his mind.
    Franklin, on the other hand, is very different. It's the overt actions that he seems concious of and tries to restrain.
    On the last episode, when Franklin and James were coming back from the spa, did anyone notice how Franklin was sitting in the car as compared to his other times with James? He appeared to be more open, more at ease and more "come heither." This is a progressive attitude of attraction that is not easy to fake. It doesn't show someone slowing forcing themselves foward, but rather someone slowly opening up and slowing letting down the restraints. Restraints that Wes never showed.
    But more importantly, something else happened there in the car that was so subtle, so unobtrusive that it had to be genuine. Franklin rubbed the knuckle of his left hand up against the side of James' knee. It was an unconcious, comfortable show of attraction. It was something that an actor couldn't have thought of doing on improptu. And definately so much on the sly that no attention was brought to it that it escaped the camera man, the producers and even (the dunce) James himself. An actor would have been so proud of himself if he HAD managed to think up this wonderful way of sending a message of attraction, he would have waited for the right moment to do it so it WOULD be noticed, therefor making it not subtle at all.

    People, remember the underlying tenets of gaydar:
    1) it's not WHAT he does, it's what he DOESN'T do.
    2) It's all in the details, not what's in the "big picture."
    Absolutely right!! My partner and I definitely caught that rubbing-of-the-knuckle against the jeans gesture; and, the hand was upturned. That's a positive, receptive type of communication. An actor probably wouldn't necessarily know that.

  7. #27
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    I didnt think it was fair how they got a closeup of James and Wes but not James an Brian
    Wes seems like the type of guy that always has to be in the spotlight.
    I wish that could have been me kissing brian! He's so hott!!

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by smatt1973
    Wouldn't he gay it up a bit if he were trying to win the 25K.
    Well, except for Dan, none of the other straight guys 'gayed it up'. I think the majority philosophy was to basically be themselves, save for a few lies about boyfriends. You know what they say: when you lie, you should stick to the truth as much as possible!

  9. #29
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    My strategy and I am sticking with it LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by FranFan
    James should have had his tongue down each of their throats if he wanted to really find out who was straight! Kissing WAS allowed - I never read a stipulation prohibiting French kissing.
    If all these guys are in this to get James, as they contend they are, the gay ones would at least be able to handle a nice, deep French kiss. Better stated, they would know how to react appropriately even if they felt it a bit forward.

    There is no way a straight man would be able to fake a reaction to said face sucking while being filmed. A peck or even quick open mouthed kiss maybe. A completely unexpected, real, passionate, mind blowing, knee weakening, kiss? No way!

    FF (who is now willing to concede that Franklin was likely eliminated by James - not necessarily for the correct reason - not conceding that point yet)

  10. #30
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    Source on no open mouth kissing?

    Quote Originally Posted by monkeyboy
    On to the kissing - I agree that the kisses mean less than nothing.
    First of all, the mates were told no open mouth kissing was allowed. Some of them may have taken that to mean they had best stick to polite pecks.
    I know I didn't miss an episode - have watched all of them at least twice. Where did this information come from?

    What I read from Bravo was that kissing was allowed. No qualification.

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