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Thread: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series *spoilers*

  1. #81
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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series

    Quote Originally Posted by cantstopwatchin View Post
    I don't think Jon is dead either. I believe he's going to come back (a la Berric Dondarrion, who was raised by the red priest while Jon has Melissandre) and he will be Azor Ahai reborn.

    Re: your list - I think the Griffin is Jon and I think the Mummer's Dragon = Aegon (mummer meaning fake/false so he could be the 'fake dragon' and not a true Targaryen). That's the only reason I think Aegon might not be Rhaegar's son.
    I think that it's a definite possibility that Jon will be Azor Ahai reborn, especially since Melisandre keeps looking in the flames for Stannis, believing HE is AA and she only sees Jon. I also think that it's totally plausible that he's the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna. While we're told that he's named after Jon Arryn, he could have just as easily been named after Jon Connington, Rhaegar's close friend.

    The other reason I think the Aegon with Connington might not be the true Aegon comes from what Varys says at the end of the epilogue of ADWD. He tells Kevan that Aegon is "here." Not at Storm's End or with Connington, but here, which to me means King's Landing. It made me think that the other Aegon is a decoy and that the real Aegon was raised right under everyones' noses in King's Landing.

    The wait for TWOW is going to kill me. All these theories and no answers....
    Last edited by Critical; 12-12-2011 at 04:28 AM. Reason: spelling counts
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  2. #82
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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series

    Happy holidays fellow impatient readers. A present for you all. GRRM has released an excerpt from Winds of Winter on his website. Enjoy!!

    GRRM - Wild Cards Sample
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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series

    Thank you! I totally got goosebumps opening that link It's so crazy in the house right now - I'm going to wait 'til later to read it so I can do it undisturbed.....and probably to draw out the anticipation a bit!
    Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' - Isaac Asimov

    I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "... I drank what?"

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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series

    I debated about where to post this, but I think this is just more about the books, even though there is some discussion of the show:
    WATCH: George R.R. Martin Reads From His Next Book, 'The Winds Of Winter'

    There's one @40 minute video interview with GRRM and a link afterwards to a second part. Starting around the 30 minute mark, he reads from TWOW. Some really good questions from the audience about the books too

    ETA: Okay, the video in that link is part 3 of the interview. Here are parts 1 and 2:
    In Conversation With... George R.R. Martin on Game of Thrones Part 1 | TIFF Bell Lightbox - YouTube
    In Conversation With... George R.R. Martin on Game of Thrones Part 2 | TIFF Bell Lightbox - YouTube
    Last edited by Critical; 03-30-2012 at 02:41 AM.
    Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' - Isaac Asimov

    I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "... I drank what?"

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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series

    Thank you, Critical, for the links!! I've only been able to watch the 1st but I plan on watching the others before tonight's premiere.

    There's something about listening to GRRM that I find so intriguing/soothing. His voice is so calm and he's so verbose; he's one of those people I'd really love to sit down and have a conversation with in a pub or tavern. He loves to talk, I love to talk, we could be there all night. Wonder how I send him an invite?
    "We must overcome the notion that we must be regular...it robs you of the chance to be extraordinary and leads you to the mediocre." - Uta Hagen

    “I don’t want my pain erased! As wretched as it is, I need my pain… It makes me who I am. It makes me Grumpy.” - Grumpy, Once Upon a Time

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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series

    I don't think we've discussed this yet....

    I don't think I'm alone in hoping that Jon ends up on the Iron Throne somehow and maybe married to Dany. If he actually does die and Melissandre brings him back (we know she can do that), does that make his oath to the Night's Watch null and void? After all, the oath begins "Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death...." Kind of a loophole, but it might work.
    Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' - Isaac Asimov

    I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "... I drank what?"

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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series *spoilers*

    That's an interesting interpretation of the oath. I do think that there is a possibility of Jon being on the Iron Throne, possibly with Dany; I've heard that theory put about elsewhere as well. If so, they would probably usher in a new, peaceful era, one where maybe the Wall was no longer necessary (the dragons getting rid of the white walkers?) and the Night Watch no longer needed, so Jon wouldn't have to remain with them regardless.
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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series *spoilers*

    I know it is one of the theories out there, but I don't think so, or don't want to think so. Jon's whole journey has been about learning not to put himself first - to be bound to the duty that is his. I do think he is Lyanna and Rhaegar's son, but I don't think he will give up his post. I think the real war is not the war for the Iron Throne, but the war for all of the Seven Kingdoms - the war with the Others. That's where I think Jon will come into play. He will unite the Kingdoms in the real war to save them all. I also don't think he could sit the throne, because unless there is a lot more coming, Rhaegar and Lyanna were not married, so he is not the trueborn heir. I do think Aegon is the real Aegon and I think when all is said and done he will sit the throne. I'm not sure how Dany plays into all of this. If Aegon is real, she is the aunt, so not the heir. Maybe she will be his Protector of the Realm before he comes of age, so they will in effect, rule together?

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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series *spoilers*

    It doesn't matter that Jon is a bastard- he could still rule. Robert didn't become king because of blood ties or being high-born; he took the title by force. The Targareyns before him seized Westeros with force as well; they didn't have royal claim but they had dragons. I do think Jon has, and will, play an important role in winning the North from the white walkers but he could then move to unite the land beyond the Wall, the North and the South. He would have claims/supporters in all three regions (from the wildlings due to his help at the Wall, from the North for being raised there/being Lyanna's son and Ned's putative son, and from the South/Targareyns via Rhaegar). The Southern claim would probably be the most tenuous and might require him to ally with a Southern house. Maybe Margaery will still be around, looking for her queenship and he can wed her. . Or maybe the dragons will win the South (hey, it worked before) and he will wed Dany. Or, knowing GRRM, they will all die and the dragons will be left to fly about on their lonesome.
    Last edited by CCL; 05-31-2012 at 12:18 AM.
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    Re: George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire Series *spoilers*

    Poor Margaery getting handed from would-be king to would-be king!

    At this point, I would be surprised if any major characters die - or at least any heroic characters - until the final book. I can see someone dying while helping the "right" person to get the throne. Whatever happens, I'll be crushed if Tyrion, Arya or Jon die. I mean, I'll be sad to lose more characters than just those, but they're my favorites.

    I'd like to see more of Dorne and the Sand Snakes in the next book. They're tough chicks!
    Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.' - Isaac Asimov

    I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "... I drank what?"

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