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Thread: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

  1. #121
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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    Quote Originally Posted by stacerace;3303267;
    I happened to think that the fact that those 2 teams that wrote Joelle's name really big was pretty mean and hateful and downright despicable. She's still a human being with feelings and I think that was just wrong, regardless of her behavior, which I agree was exasperating.
    I went through this whole thread, and it's pretty disheartening to see that people support the way the others excluded Joelle like that. Of course, everyone is entitled to their opinions, and I repsect each and every one of them. But it's still disheartening to see support for pretty disgusting behavior.

    It was obvious that Joelle did not work out as hard as the rest of them, but it's not like she lied flat on the ground and basically gave up. When they were showing footage of Joelle not working, I felt that the editors were scraping at the bottom of the barrel for some scenes that showed her laziness. The only footage they showed was of Joelle walking around the training room, and then simply asking Bob if his assignment was only directed to Helen. Honestly, if that's how lazy she is, then I don't think she's been slacking off that much. Ever since Bob got through to her in his rant in Week 2, I've seen progress in Joelle, and although she was still overshadowed by all of the other players in terms of work ethic, she did put effort in her work.

    Joelle's so-called "laziness" does not give the others a reason to completely shun her to a point where it's borderline bullying. When the others were talking to Joelle, I felt like all of them considered themselves superior to Joelle, even with my favorite Tara. It was pretty disgusting to watch. This is a bit like what Tara did last episode with Dave, but the difference is that Tara's spiel was more constructive criticism on her part. She actually cared about the young man's future, whereas all of the players, including Carla, could practically give 2 s**ts about what Joelle does.

    All of their comments weren't even helpful. They didn't try to reach to Joelle, or even try and help her out. They contiuously beat Joelle with words, and more words, and even more words. What good are they going to do? Get your emotions out? Well, I think the others should realize that when someone is down, like Joelle was, it's not a good thing to keep on kicking them while they're down. To enlarge her name on the voting slips? Despicable. To act like Carla was some queen while Joelle was a sort of a peasant? Vile. Then to completely disregard her existance in the voting room by not saying goodbye? Downright awful.

    Quote Originally Posted by CCL;3303122;
    I thought it was a bit rich for Aubrey to go off on Joelle for not working hard enough when she only lost 2 pounds in the 30 days she was at home.
    I was going to come in here and say that also. Looks like you've been reading my mind, CCL.

    Aubrey was the worst of them all when it came to kicking Joelle when she was down. I wonder what her reasoning was behind her words. Did it make her feel empowered, make her feel that she was better than Joelle? IMO, Aubrey looks really bad in this current situation. Not only was she only able to lose a measley 2 lbs when she had a month, but she's looking down on someone who lost 0 lbs who had a week.
    Last edited by CrossingGuard; 02-04-2009 at 02:51 AM.
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  2. #122
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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    well, just as the scenes of joelle being a lazy marshmellow were just TINY parts of the show, you don't know if the other teams HAD been saying nicer and encouraging things to joelle.

    it was probably the speech before the elimination that pushed people over the edge. she was being a crazy psychopath. sometimes the only way to reach someone like that is being a little bit harsh.

    she had been given a second chance by everyone and she wasted it. in the past if people had had a really crummy weigh in the other contestants would have said WOW that person worked so hard how is that possible?! but no one said it which leads me to believe those scenes were not just tiny snippets staged to make her look lazy. we saw how mad bob got at her that one week about not pushing hard.

    joelle let herself be the outsider. she decided that everyone was against her. they are all there for the right reasons and she is there to bitch and moan. i see nothing wrong with stating the obvious truth.

    while i enjoy how big they wrote joelle's name because it was mean, i am sure part of that was to show real support to carla.

    not that any of this matters. nothing got through to joelle anyway. she is continuing to play the victim and that everyone is out to get her. and i am sure that is what frustrated everyone so much. she just doesn't get it! why should they have wasted kind and supporting words on someone who was not going to use them?

  3. #123
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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    Joelle's elevator doesn't go to the top floor. I'm convinced.

  4. #124
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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    Quote Originally Posted by tenchikiss;3303336;
    well, just as the scenes of joelle being a lazy marshmellow were just TINY parts of the show, you don't know if the other teams HAD been saying nicer and encouraging things to joelle.

    she had been given a second chance by everyone and she wasted it. in the past if people had had a really crummy weigh in the other contestants would have said WOW that person worked so hard how is that possible?! but no one said it which leads me to believe those scenes were not just tiny snippets staged to make her look lazy. we saw how mad bob got at her that one week about not pushing hard.
    I think the others made their initial opinion their lasting opinion. If Joelle was really that much of a slacker this past episode, they would have showed more footage of her laziness other than her walking around and asking a question to Bob.

    I rooted for Joelle, but even I have to say that Joelle wasn't the greatest when it came to workouts. She never quit, which I commend her for after the numerous beatings she received. But she still gave up sometimes (like how she didn't stay on the treadmill for the alotted time that Bob gave her) and did not do as challenging of workouts as the others. But just because Joelle was weak doesn't mean the others had to completely downgrade her out of their own frustration. It doesn't help.

    Quote Originally Posted by tenchikiss;3303336;
    it was probably the speech before the elimination that pushed people over the edge. she was being a crazy psychopath. sometimes the only way to reach someone like that is being a little bit harsh.
    I don't think she was a psychopath, but I agree that she harped in her speech a little too much.

    But I really don't think these people tried to reach out to her at all. If they did actually care about her, you'd think that they would have at least said goodbye to her when she left. But nope, not only did Joelle not receive a hug, but they also only said, "Goodbye Carla!" as the two of them walked out. If they really did try to reach out to Joelle, then they would have given more sympathy towards her.

    Quote Originally Posted by tenchikiss;3303336;
    joelle let herself be the outsider. she decided that everyone was against her. they are all there for the right reasons and she is there to bitch and moan. i see nothing wrong with stating the obvious truth.
    Ultimately, it's Joelle's own problem with how hard she works out and tries. She didn't unload her problems on the others. It was the others that made her problem their own. It's pretty necessary to be self-aware with everyone else's situation when you're in a game like TBL since you eventually have to vote for people to go home, but instead of mostly focusing on themselves, the contesnants have spent about half of the episodes aired so far complaining about Joelle. They all did their hourly workouts, but they still spent way too much time caring about what this woman did. It's human nature to be frustrated with one of your colleagues who doesn't try so hard, but their frustration got so bad that Joelle became the outsider. If the others hadn't made Joelle's situation their problem and instead had tried to support her, then Joelle would have never found herself on the outside.

    Joelle moaned in her confessionals from time to time, but I rarely saw her release her own frustration out towards the others. The first time she ever backsassed someone was with Carla, during her and Bob's visit to Detroit. After that, we only saw her unleash how she felt on the others this past episode.

    Quote Originally Posted by tenchikiss;3303336;
    while i enjoy how big they wrote joelle's name because it was mean, i am sure part of that was to show real support to carla.
    That's true, actually. But it was still a pretty big burn towards Joelle regardless of their reasoning. And not to mention that it must have hurt when she saw people write , "We'll miss you, Carla!" and her name in huge letters.

    Quote Originally Posted by tenchikiss;3303336;
    not that any of this matters. nothing got through to joelle anyway. she is continuing to play the victim and that everyone is out to get her. and i am sure that is what frustrated everyone so much. she just doesn't get it! why should they have wasted kind and supporting words on someone who was not going to use them?
    But Joelle was the victim. Joelle wasn't attacking the others, so how would they be the victims in this situation. Joelle was focusing on her own problems, and in the process, the other contestants also focused on them and eventually chose to put her on the outside because of them.

    Your last line makes total sense. That's probably how the players felt concerning Joelle. But I believe that this whole situation would have turned upside down if all of this vented angered had not come towards Joelle. What if the others had supported Joelle all the way through? Would Joelle have more motivated to keep on striding forward?

    If the other players felt that their anger might have pushed her, it was never going to work because it's not their position to try and anger her into working out. That was Bob, and Bob actually did succeed in getting through to Joelle. But, it would have been beneficial if the others would have been there as a support system. Alas, that didn't happen, and all I'm wondering now is if Joelle would have the courage to come to the reunion.

    By the way, I hope you don't mind me picking apart your post like this. I just felt that it was the best way to organize my responses.

    ETA: I should add that I thought Joelle & Carla were the right choice to go. Their decision put Joelle out of her misery she experienced throughout the whole time she was there. But not only that, but I believed that the two of them had enough of an experience to be successful at home. If anything, the show taught Joelle a lesson to be a stronger person with her workouts. If it takes Bob yelling at her to realize that she needs to try thismuch more, then so be it. And Carla has always had the determination to keep moving forward. Although the Brown Team is only one of two teams to have experienced the ranch all the way through, it's obvious that the both of them need help. The kid's only 18 yo, and not even gastric bypass surgery helped the dad.
    Last edited by CrossingGuard; 02-04-2009 at 04:23 AM.
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  5. #125
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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    Joelle. Losing weight is 70% diet. This shows that she really fell down on her food intake as well. The extreme exercise they do on this show certainly burns more calories than any of us will, fitting exercise into out lives, but working out is for tonning and overall health for most of us. On Dietribe (stupid show), a woman broke her arm seriously and had to remain immobile for a week after having pins inserted in her wrist. She stuck to her diet and lost 7 pounds that week, more than her exercising friends. I just lost 20 pounds in 5 weeks with diet alone. There was no excuse for a zero.

    I agree with all who support Joelle's harsh treatment. They bonded with Carla and watched Joelle's blatant disregard for her daily. These are compassionate people; I believe they had good reason to be furious. Their rage was fueled by their love and suppport for Carla. Had this been an individual challenge no one would have been upset.

    Editing didn't show us everything either. It would not surprise me to learn they tried to encourge her.

    Joelle's lack of remorse stunned me. She lacks empathy, compassion and insight.

  6. #126
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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    I always hate to see people gang up on someone, but in this case, I can understand the anger of those people who were at the ranch. They sent a much loved team home to give Joelle a second chance... (well, that was part of the reason) and are naturally p'od that she didn't take that second chance to heart.
    What confuses me is the amount of anger some of the returnees had! They weren't the ones to give her a second chance, and yet they were behaving as though they had been personally slighted. Ridiculous.
    Though the blue team wrote Joelle's name larger, their speech to Joelle and Carla was so much nicer and classier than the other teams. I give them much credit for that.

  7. #127
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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    I thought the right team went home this week, altho from a gaming standpoint, the brown team should have been the one to go home. I'm tired of the dad crying when he's not able to get the numbers he needs for the team. They will probably be the next to go home.

    I have not bonded w/Joelle. I don't think anyone else bonded with her. For whatever reason, she did not do well at the ranch. I would have been ticked at the comments if I'd been the one who received them. We don't know what was going on in her life. We don't know her health/home concerns. We also don't know that the editting wasn't grossly manipulated. (We think it was "right on" because of how the other people reacted to Joelle). And it could have been that Joelle had had enough (with both Bob and Carla yelling/cursing). I would have wanted to go home, myself. I hope both Carla and Joelle do well. I wonder if both of them come back to the Finale show.

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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    The show was pretty painful for me to watch and I was hitting the skip button quite a bit on my DVR.

    I'll start with Joelle and Carla. First, I have to say that the scenes from a couple of weeks ago when Joelle and Bob went back to Detroit showed me a lot about the relationship between Carla and Joelle. I don't think it was ever a great relationship. And I won't try to defend Joelle's excuses. She certainly didn't seem to have a clue. But I also cannot defend Carla's behavior toward Joelle. It's one thing to confront someone. It's yet another to constantly berate that person. My opinion, based solely on what they showed between the two of them, is that Carla is a bully. I thought it was very sad that the two of them had not spoken since leaving the ranch. Contrary to what most of you seem to think, the person I felt most sorry for in the first meeting since leaving the ranch was Joelle. Carla had already expressed her feelings at the time they were eliminated. Certainly Carla has every right to be angry with Joelle. But to continue to carry that grudge around for months afterward speaks to Carla's character. Joelle asks Carla how she's doing and wants to know about her weight loss, and Carla goes off on Joelle all over again. What purpose does that serve? I have to tell you that I have personally been granted forgiveness when I didn't deserve it. And that forgiveness has changed my life. If Carla is such a good friend to Joelle, she could go a long way by extending some forgiveness. She kept berating Joelle for only thinking of herself, but it seemed to me that's exactly what Carla was doing as well. But, I was glad to see this team go because it's been so hard to watch them. And I'm glad that both of them seem to be losing weight at home. Good for them!

    I know lots of people like the Brown team, but the dad keeps pulling low numbers. He keeps harping on the fact that he's working hard in the gym. But I want to know what he's eating. He should be losing more weight if he is eating right. If they are below the line again next week, I see them being the next to go. The dad's impassioned pleas for his son are getting a little old with me. If he's so concerned about his son staying there, he needs to start figuring out why he's not losing as much weight as the others on a consistent basis.

    Aubrey's 2-lb loss in 30 days and then her excuses made me crazy. But thank you Bob and Jillian for trashing those excuses! They made me want to stand up and cheer. But, then we get the scenes with Aubrey on the bike and Jillian talking to her. She asks Aubrey how much time she spent in the gym. Aubrey says 4-5 hours a day. Jillian asks her why she didn't lose more, and Aubrey says it's the food. So, here's the perfect lead-in for Jillian to actually talk about what to eat and about the fact that 70-80% of weight loss comes from what we eat rather than how much exercise we get. And what's Jillian's response? "Aubrey needs to learn to ask for help." Say what? Not, "okay, tell me what you've been eating." Not, "let's discuss what you should be eating." None of that. Just, "Aubrey needs to learn to ask for help." Lame!

    When Shanon got up there and had a 15-lb loss for the 30 days, I was so excited for her. It's a shame that she felt sad about it. 15 pounds in 30 days is amazing! I loved how she worked so hard in the gym even if it made her cry. She just kept going. And when she carried Sione on her back across the gym, I was really cheering for her. That was definitely the highlight of the episode!

    Marilyn

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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    Joelle was a selfish person, its unfortunate that she was able to stay on the ranch anyways,being as though Carla surely needed it more than her being as though she was almost 400 lbs. I do not blame Carla for being ticked off, I would have gone off on someone who I trusted with my life, which Carla basically did. In regards to friendships, you know sometimes you don’t know how people deal with adversity in friendships, It seems like Joelle just didn’t give a damn, which is unfortunate, I mean she even made Bob curse…

    Carla already looks good after losing that 87 lbs, and Im hoping she knocks the socks off everyone at the finale!!!

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    Re: 2/3 Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

    I am hoping that Carla and/or Dan have the chance to return to the ranch.
    You've got to kiss a few frogs before you find your prince!

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