Michael

[Muduh]

Originally Posted by edgeover17

All I remember them telling her was that there had been a terrorist attack on the WTC and that her cousin's status was not known. They gave her no details.

Like Qboots, I seem to remember that she was given the option to leave if she felt that she needed to go home. Someone who remembers more, help us.

[Google]

 

[decan]

Originally Posted by mom2

Because he wanted to. And because he is a productive "PERSON" over the age of 21 he is allowed to make his own choices. Do you really think he hasn't looked in the mirror ? What I see is a man of quality, what others see is up to them. He has just as much right to try his hand at this game as any of the others, and I say "THANK GOODNESS" for someone of quality character there instead of the fluffs/snobs to which we are usually treated.
Even if he does not win, place or show he has comported himself thus far with respect and I'm proud that he is from my state.

Edited to change "male" to "PERSON".

I'm not denying his character or sincerity.... he is who he is and I don't doubt that one bit. What I'm concern about is what he's getting into in the context of BB and BB only! What he's up to out of the BB house I cannot say because I don't know him that well (and frankly I don't want to know). But since I'm a BB viewer like the rest of you and Micheal IS a contestant on this year's show, I am giving my opinion based on that and that only.

So to say something like....

Originally Posted by Qboots

I'm pretty comfortable with letting Michael judge what's best for Michael. He'll be fine.

is not quite right because since this is BB, a TV show, the home viewers are more or less participants to this little "reality-TV" realm.... and from the moment Micheal and the others signed on that dotted line to come on this season's show, they're subject to our (home viewers) criticisms and judgments. Why are most of us have absolutely no reserve for being so hard on Scott or Jase but when it comes to Micheal we aren't even allow to say a bad word about him? Is there a double standard here? Granted the reasons for "hating" the frat-boys are almost always well founded and Micheal is a guy who is easily well liked and give sympathy to but the fact of the matter is he's not perfect either and he has faults and those faults happen to be about his vulnerability or emotional vulnerability of his personal affairs which would HIGHLY jepordize his chances on a game-show already not really playing well in his favor in the first place. It's not fair to him and it's bad TV. Again I'm just saying that to help look out for the guy.

Originally Posted by Muduh

I have to assume that no one in this discussion knows Michael personally. If that is truly the case, how on earth can any one of us sit and determine his mental or physical capacity? For all we know he may be as dumb as a stump or a borderline rocket scientist. I'm in no position to determine any of that. I have enough trouble trying to correct my own grammatical errors and spelling.
As far as him needing to be out of the house to get himself straight, I have to agree. I feel that it was totally unfair to ever put him in the position he finds himself. Now that he is in the position, I admire him for hanging in.
I just like him because he is more "my kind of people". I also think he could use the money more than anyone else in the house.

That's not quite right. It is true that I don't know Micheal personally nor am I an expert on him and his affairs. However, if you had watched the show entirely like I had (and still am) then you know there is quite alot of info about him and his family on TV and you can't tell me (generally speaking and assuming you have watched every second of the show so far of course) you don't have a feel of who Micheal is and what this guy is about, right? Thus I'm just drawing on what we know so far (his trait and what he's like by watching how he interacts with his other housemates) to conclude the things I've said about him.

In theory it is admirable for him to "hang in there" for as long as it takes.... but frankly in reality, it's not really that easy. He may be comfortable with who he is but there are other people, mainly marvin and the other frat-boys, who are so easily judgemental towards him (being the odd-person out) that Micheal in the end has to do things that he wouldn't normally do and not being himself just to survive. Either conform to the demands of the frat-crowd or lose (just think about the other Mike's example.... Jase has clearly stated if he's not with the in-crowd he's out..... and now Mike is on the chopping block)

Now you honestly tell me Micheal has the mental and physical means to combat THAT problem? It's not fair to him.

[duplessis3]

Originally Posted by edgeover17

All I remember them telling her was that there had been a terrorist attack on the WTC and that her cousin's status was not known. They gave her no details.

THat's how I remember it - that they didn't tell the houseguests and she wasn't given details (which might have enabled her to make a better decision) The analogy to Michael is that he can't discuss this with his mom or his other sibling or his fiancee.

BTW: I think its strange that people that aren't hardcore Michael fans are seen as liking the pretty boys. There are other options. Right now, I either haven't seen enough of them (Lori, Michael, Nikomis, Adria) or can't stand them. THose stupid frat boy types and Holly remind me of high school
And I really hate this twist. (Im betting it came up during a background check on them since Michael doesn't use his bio dad's last name.)

[waywyrd]

Originally Posted by decan

It is true that I don't know Micheal personally nor am I an expert on him and his affairs.

If you don't know him how can you say this -

Now you honestly tell me Micheal has the mental and physical means to combat THAT problem? It's not fair to him.

Do you think there's something wrong with his mental capacity? Does he have to be a muscle-bound gym-rat to do well in physical competitions? He's a grown man, I'm sure he can handle himself.

Why are most of us have absolutely no reserve for being so hard on Scott or Jase but when it comes to Micheal we aren't even allow to say a bad word about him?

Not true. They all signed up, and yes, they are all subject to be criticized and judged by the viewers. Scott and Jase get a lot of flak because of how they act, for the kind of people they are. Michael seems to be getting crap because some people think he can't handle being in this situation, which has not been proven. Just because he doesn't fit some people's stereotypes of who "should" be playing BB. Don't assume he's just a dumb hick because of his appearance and demeanor, he hasn't done anything to deserve that stereotype.

Scott and Jase, on the other hand, have.

[edgeover17]

Okay, I'll chime in here.

What a network wants when they cast non-actors in a show like reality shows or game shows, is someone whom the vierwers will either LIKE or DISLIKE. Indifference is the last thing they want. They want you to look at the participant and hope they either WIN or LOSE. That's what gets folks to tune in. The debate among us here over Michael is exactly what the network shoots for. They don't care, and neither should we, who is partial to what type.

I'd say the inclusion of Michael on the show was a casting ploy by CBS. Michael looks to be the polar opposite of the frat-boy type. It's as if CBS said, "Okay, if you don't like the frat boys...how about THIS ?"

Now, I have to confess that I'm no big fan of the frat boys or the cowboy either. (Sorry, just tough to please !) But I think I see what CBS's casting strategy is on this. They've tried to give us some frat boys, an anti-frat boy, and some who are neither.

Now, lest anyone get wrong ideas about me I want to discuss the girls too ! With them, CBS has given us a ditz, a wholesome, down-home type, an artist, and several in-betweens.

It's all about casting, folks, and I don't think CBS would have given a minute's thought as to who would have the best chance to win when they came up with it.

[Qboots]

Originally Posted by decan

Why are most of us have absolutely no reserve for being so hard on Scott or Jase but when it comes to Micheal we aren't even allow to say a bad word about him?

Dude, of course you can say what you want about Michael. We all have that right. You don't think he makes for good TV, and that's perfectly acceptable. But at my house he does make for good TV. I'm infinitely more interested in what he says or does than in anything the meatheads say or do. I hope he sticks around. But I certainly don't expect all of the other 21,163 FORT members to agree with me.

[Qboots]

Originally Posted by duplessis3

THat's how I remember it - that they didn't tell the houseguests and she wasn't given details (which might have enabled her to make a better decision) The analogy to Michael is that he can't discuss this with his mom or his other sibling or his fiancee.

OK - I'm almost ashamed to admit this, but I was taking notes during season 2 of Big Brother and I finally dug them up.

The show was off the air for almost 2 weeks due to 9/11. On the night they returned this is what I wrote: "The houseguests were told about the terrorist attacks. Monica's family is in NYC and her cousin works at the WTC. But the game went on and no one left the house."

Sorry, that's all there was. So they were all informed, and all chose to remain in the game. It must have been very difficult for Monica to not talk to her family right at that moment. But she only had to wait about a week, as the game was near the end. I'll bet if it had happened in week one, the producers would have pulled the plug on the show.

I'm sure Michael is dying to talk to his family, as is Jenn. But since we're just beginning the game, it's possible that one or both of them may be in there for the whole 3 months. We'll see what kind of a toll this takes on them, if any.

[decan]

Originally Posted by waywyrd

If you don't know him how can you say this -

Do you think there's something wrong with his mental capacity? Does he have to be a muscle-bound gym-rat to do well in physical competitions? He's a grown man, I'm sure he can handle himself.

Like I spilled out earlier, I don't know him completely but the few things (attributes) I know about the guy stem from everything we've seen on TV.... and it's safe to say I've know enough to pass a few judgements on him..... not just unfounded criticisms but really, constructive criticisms that is in the best interest of Micheal. My words mean him no harm.

I'm sure he can handle himself too. But he's not handling it all that well I guess is what I'm saying here.

Not true. They all signed up, and yes, they are all subject to be criticized and judged by the viewers. Scott and Jase get a lot of flak because of how they act, for the kind of people they are. Michael seems to be getting crap because some people think he can't handle being in this situation, which has not been proven. Just because he doesn't fit some people's stereotypes of who "should" be playing BB. Don't assume he's just a dumb hick because of his appearance and demeanor, he hasn't done anything to deserve that stereotype.

Scott and Jase, on the other hand, have.

I never said Micheal was dumb or a hick! Let's be clear on that.... all I'm saying is his playing field is uneven right from the get-go.... like I asked before, how come he has to work X-times harder to have sort of any advantage in the game than others like Scott, Drew, Lori and so on? Is it really in the best interest of him to be in that kind of setting/ situation?

Originally Posted by edgeover17

Okay, I'll chime in here.

What a network wants when they cast non-actors in a show like reality shows or game shows, is someone whom the vierwers will either LIKE or DISLIKE. Indifference is the last thing they want. They want you to look at the participant and hope they either WIN or LOSE. That's what gets folks to tune in. The debate among us here over Michael is exactly what the network shoots for. They don't care, and neither should we, who is partial to what type.

I'd say the inclusion of Michael on the show was a casting ploy by CBS. Michael looks to be the polar opposite of the frat-boy type. It's as if CBS said, "Okay, if you don't like the frat boys...how about THIS ?"

Now, I have to confess that I'm no big fan of the frat boys or the cowboy either. (Sorry, just tough to please !) But I think I see what CBS's casting strategy is on this. They've tried to give us some frat boys, an anti-frat boy, and some who are neither.

Now, lest anyone get wrong ideas about me I want to discuss the girls too ! With them, CBS has given us a ditz, a wholesome, down-home type, an artist, and several in-betweens.

It's all about casting, folks, and I don't think CBS would have given a minute's thought as to who would have the best chance to win when they came up with it.

You darn right it's casting. That's why I've said before that it IS the fault of CBS for the bad cast on this season's BB, not Micheal's nor Scott's etc..... the dynamics of this year's group is substandard at best and I'm afraid that they're trying to imitate last year's little jewel- the ever more popular 3 stooges (or amigos, whichever is your taste) .....with this year's over-sized, over-buffed frat-boys galore.... as if they think we can't get enough of "that" kind of garbage!

I'm not saying CBS should be biased towards which person should have better chances to win..... in fact I advocate the opposite. I want everybody to be on a level playing field right from the start and by casting a couple of odd-ball-types (ie Micheal, Jen) into a sea of a-bit-above-average-schmos, I just couldn't see how Micheal or Jen can survive for the long haul..... in fact what we saw was exactly as I preached. Jennifer and Mike is on the chopping block and the only reason why Micheal (the other odd-ball of the group) wasn't in line behind Jen and Mike is because he was smart enough to bond with the powerhouses currently standing in the top ranks. But Micheal has paid a heavy price..... he not only is not acting like himself (I highly doubt he would constantly rub himself half naked back in his hometown in Oklahoma) but he also has made himself vulnerable by revealing something that is "life-altering" or "life-changing" which should be a private matter, not expose yourself like that on national TV and not just any national TV..... you are, afterall, on BB playing a GAME for half a mil! So you tell me what kind of advantage does Micheal or Jen and the other few odd-balls posses (as far as this game is concern)?

[Muduh]

Qboots, I concede to your note pad. I thought I remembered that Julie asked if she wanted to leave. Must have been wrong. Anyway, I don't think that the two incidents can be compared, do you? The show was almost over for Monica but has only begun for Michael. Not making light of Monica's situation, but to me, this is even more serious. There was nothing she could do for her family. Michael can do plenty.

[Qboots]

Michael's probably thinking that his family situation has been the same for 23 years, no harm in waiting a couple more months to meet his Dad. I'm sure people can voluntarily leave this game if they want to, but he probably doesn't want to throw away possibly his only chance of ever winning a decent chunk of change.