Really? I don't see him that way at all. But to clarify, I would just say that I see him more that way than Jef.... neither of them is really very edgy IMO.
Can someone give me a hint as to what to google to find that picture? I have tried like crazy to find it and I don't think I am seeing the right one(s).
How is Jef being disingenuous? From all the pictures I've seen of him he has a quirky and unique sense of personal style, he's hip and cool, so it stands to reason that his friends and business partners might also not be junior league candidates. Clean cut does NOT necessarily mean someone is better than a person who has long hair, dresses a different way, or has piercings and/or tattoos. He and his friends have managed to create a pretty impressive company and are quite successful. His true self will be reflected in how he treats people, what he stands for, how he thinks and feels, not in how long his hair is or isn't, or what his friends look like.
Sorry, but I think who you hang out with reflects on you. These guys are not hip and cool; they are stoned and whacked out. On a scale of 1-100 where 100 is clean-cut and junior league, these guys are minus 20.
I'm still having to try and not misjudge Jef because of how much he reminds me of my former friend. My former friend is not successful and lived off of his mom for years. That does not sound like Jef at all.