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Thread: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

  1. #491
    FORT Fanatic lavender1960's Avatar
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    Quote Originally Posted by sushifan;3634266;
    First of all, it's hearsay -- sorry, I'm a lawyer.

    Secondly, this isn't a court of law. (Though, incidentally, there are lots of cases in which hearsay is perfectly admissible in court. In addition, hearsay is admissible as evidence in many other judicial proceedings, such as grand jury deliberations, probation hearings, parole revocation hearings, and proceedings before administrative bodies. But I digress.) We're operating in the court of public opinion here. As such, every person can judge for him or herself whether to believe the allegations out there about Ed.

    If I were a judge or juror, and this were some sort of civil suit, I would consider the people to whom I have spoken, and the evidence I have seen, to be very credible. But that is a decision I have made for myself. Like others on this board, I'm not going to post everything I saw or heard to help me make that decision. I know full well that that may make me less credible, but so be it. There are many people out there who will never believe the substance of these allegations, even if I were to lay everything I know out on paper, or if/when a more "major" publication goes public with them. And you know what? That's their prerogative. If I were in their shoes, I'm not sure I'd believe me either. Sometimes truth is indeed stranger than fiction.

    I appreciate that everyone is trying to figure this out in his/her own way, and I appreciate that most (including the post I quoted above) are trying to do so respectfully. I somehow doubt that enough "proof" will be produced to satisfy everyone, but that's life. We're not being asked to decide a case and no one's personal liberty depends upon us. No one is obligated to prove anything to us, just as we're not obligated to render a decision.

    Incidentally, civil cases are generally decided on a "preponderance of the evidence" standard, meaning that as a juror, I need only be 51% or more convinced of the allegations in order to believe them "true" for legal purposes. I'm more than 51% convinced here.

    Take all this for what it's worth -- I hear this post plus $2.25 will get you a ride on the NYC subway

    Very well said. I have forgotten that hearsay is admissible evidence in many instances. A grand jury indictment is no small potatoes.

    Who said the Bachelor/ette wasn't educational.
    Last edited by lavender1960; 08-03-2009 at 01:51 PM.

  2. #492
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    Quote Originally Posted by sushifan;3634266;
    First of all, it's hearsay -- sorry, I'm a lawyer.

    Secondly, this isn't a court of law. (Though, incidentally, there are lots of cases in which hearsay is perfectly admissible in court. In addition, hearsay is admissible as evidence in many other judicial proceedings, such as grand jury deliberations, probation hearings, parole revocation hearings, and proceedings before administrative bodies. But I digress.) We're operating in the court of public opinion here. As such, every person can judge for him or herself whether to believe the allegations out there about Ed.

    If I were a judge or juror, and this were some sort of civil suit, I would consider the people to whom I have spoken, and the evidence I have seen, to be very credible. But that is a decision I have made for myself. Like others on this board, I'm not going to post everything I saw or heard to help me make that decision. I know full well that that may make me less credible, but so be it. There are many people out there who will never believe the substance of these allegations, even if I were to lay everything I know out on paper, or if/when a more "major" publication goes public with them. And you know what? That's their prerogative. If I were in their shoes, I'm not sure I'd believe me either. Sometimes truth is indeed stranger than fiction.

    I appreciate that everyone is trying to figure this out in his/her own way, and I appreciate that most (including the post I quoted above) are trying to do so respectfully. I somehow doubt that enough "proof" will be produced to satisfy everyone, but that's life. We're not being asked to decide a case and no one's personal liberty depends upon us. No one is obligated to prove anything to us, just as we're not obligated to render a decision.

    Incidentally, civil cases are generally decided on a "preponderance of the evidence" standard, meaning that as a juror, I need only be 51% or more convinced of the allegations in order to believe them "true" for legal purposes. I'm more than 51% convinced here.

    Take all this for what it's worth -- I hear this post plus $2.25 will get you a ride on the NYC subway

  3. #493
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    Quote Originally Posted by brittyiswitty;3634240;
    WHAT purpose does this exposure serves? Is the intent for Jill to run back to Reid? Who will it hurt Jill or the girls exposing them selves to the media? I personally did not hear Ed mention anything about having a girlfriend or even their names? This really baffles me to no end.
    I believe the "purpose" is to expose the inner workings of a reality tv show. Isn't that what FORT is about--looking beyond what is obvious and what is given to us by TPTB? This forum is for sleuthing and for gathering (and sharing) information. I think all information should be welcomed and assessed. I personally thank posters like cheekychook and sdl for their thoughtful contributions.

  4. #494
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    I want to know if all these rumors were about Reid and girlfriends which I am sure he was dating before going on the show

    ....if people would have been so interested in his private life as they are with Ed?

    Seems all the people so gung ho on finding out what this girl said and that girl said, and what text they can muster up, and the stories are getting worse and worse defaming his character were all from people rooting for the guy she didn't want though personable and edited favorably .... Reid....

    Seems so strange so much effort from people who disliked Ed, or people who may have wanted to take the pressure off of Wes because they were his buddies have found so much "dirt" on this professional, hardworking guy who happened to go on a reality show and fall in love..

    Why are they not mentioning how they are totally into family reunions, going to her cousins wedding, and having a wonderful time together??? Where is the research on all of these things....????

    ...and that is why I am totally suspicious of any "research" these people, who have some vendetta to get Ed come up with.

  5. #495
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    Quote Originally Posted by Luv2Cruise;3634228;
    I totally get standing by people's fav's in this show, what I don't get is how information from trusted posters about the FRC is accepted without them having to "out" their source, but information that may be a bit less palatable is dismissed unless an equally trusted poster will out their source or show verifiable proof

    I don't want to see Jill hurt any more than anyone else does, and I can imagine this is a very difficult thing for the GF(s) to do - they did not sign on to a reality tv show and they are about to air their dirty laundry in front of all of America - so I am willing to put some stock into what I am being told if one of these women comes forward. I doubt anyon would put themselves in a position to be ridiculed or vilified on a whim. JMO
    I totally agree with this post. It seems like when CC had a source re the AFTR that Ed was F1 that there was no question that was true from those that are questioning Ed's GF issues and demanding proof and sources. I guess it is a double standard. They believe anything positive about Ed without question but want "proof" for the negative things. Oh well.

  6. #496
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    Quote Originally Posted by trisha22;3634290;
    I want to know if all these rumors were about Reid and girlfriends which I am sure he was dating before going on the show

    ....if people would have been so interested in his private life as they are with Ed?

    Seems all the people so gung ho on finding out what this girl said and that girl said, and what text they can muster up, and the stories are getting worse and worse defaming his character were all from people rooting for the guy she didn't want though personable and edited favorably .... Reid....

    Seems so strange so much effort from people who disliked Ed, or people who may have wanted to take the pressure off of Wes because they were his buddies have found so much "dirt" on this professional, hardworking guy who happened to go on a reality show and fall in love..

    Why are they not mentioning how they are totally into family reunions, going to her cousins wedding, and having a wonderful time together??? Where is the research on all of these things....????

    ...and that is why I am totally suspicious of any "research" these people, who have some vendetta to get Ed come up with.
    I don't think it matters which guy the info comes out on - if there is someone on the show who is not who they say they are, people are going to try and find them out! It's not an Ed vs. Reid vs. Wes thing at all (IMHO) - I think Cheeky/sdl/whoever would present their info regardless of who it is.

    Edited to add: I don't think your bolded makes sense? At least not to me. Why would these activities require research?

  7. #497
    FORT Fogey cheekychook's Avatar
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    Quote Originally Posted by trisha22;3634290;
    I want to know if all these rumors were about Reid and girlfriends which I am sure he was dating before going on the show

    ....if people would have been so interested in his private life as they are with Ed?

    Seems all the people so gung ho on finding out what this girl said and that girl said, and what text they can muster up, and the stories are getting worse and worse defaming his character were all from people rooting for the guy she didn't want though personable and edited favorably .... Reid....

    Seems so strange so much effort from people who disliked Ed, or people who may have wanted to take the pressure off of Wes because they were his buddies have found so much "dirt" on this professional, hardworking guy who happened to go on a reality show and fall in love..

    Why are they not mentioning how they are totally into family reunions, going to her cousins wedding, and having a wonderful time together??? Where is the research on all of these things....????

    ...and that is why I am totally suspicious of any "research" these people, who have some vendetta to get Ed come up with.
    First off, I had a bit of info about Ed before the season even aired. I had never even heard of Reid at the time.

    I have never understood how making one person look bad makes another look good---IMO it just makes them both look bad.

    I personally have not worked hard to dig up any dirt at all. The best I can explain that is to say that a lot of the stuff that is labeled as "gossip" and "rumor" is actually stuff that was quite commonly known in Chicago. Ed didn't actually try very hard to cover anything up, and lots of people knew about the girls involved. Ed didn't have secret relationships with these women, they were publicly known.

    I don't know who you are referring to as having a "vendetta" against Ed and having done "research", but just in case you were wondering I had no vendetta and did no research. Hope that will clarify some things.
    "Reality is merely an illusion, although a very persistent one." - Einstein

    Karen Stivali - author and very cheeky chook

  8. #498
    FORT Fanatic biglove44's Avatar
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    Quote Originally Posted by trisha22;3634290;
    I want to know if all these rumors were about Reid and girlfriends which I am sure he was dating before going on the show

    ....if people would have been so interested in his private life as they are with Ed?

    Seems all the people so gung ho on finding out what this girl said and that girl said, and what text they can muster up, and the stories are getting worse and worse defaming his character were all from people rooting for the guy she didn't want though personable and edited favorably .... Reid....

    Seems so strange so much effort from people who disliked Ed, or people who may have wanted to take the pressure off of Wes because they were his buddies have found so much "dirt" on this professional, hardworking guy who happened to go on a reality show and fall in love..

    Why are they not mentioning how they are totally into family reunions, going to her cousins wedding, and having a wonderful time together??? Where is the research on all of these things....????

    ...and that is why I am totally suspicious of any "research" these people, who have some vendetta to get Ed come up with.
    NO ONE is trying to sabotage Ed. If Reid OR Kip were dumb enough to get themselves or even affiliate themselves in this kind of situation, the exact same thing would be happening to them as well. It's not even about message boards trying to sabotage Ed or Jillian's relationship. The information is out there and people are posting it here and on all the other bachelorette related boards too, and it just so happens to be about your favorite, Ed.

  9. #499
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    Quote Originally Posted by trisha22;3634290;
    I want to know if all these rumors were about Reid and girlfriends which I am sure he was dating before going on the show

    ....if people would have been so interested in his private life as they are with Ed?

    Seems all the people so gung ho on finding out what this girl said and that girl said, and what text they can muster up, and the stories are getting worse and worse defaming his character were all from people rooting for the guy she didn't want though personable and edited favorably .... Reid....

    Seems so strange so much effort from people who disliked Ed, or people who may have wanted to take the pressure off of Wes because they were his buddies have found so much "dirt" on this professional, hardworking guy who happened to go on a reality show and fall in love..

    Why are they not mentioning how they are totally into family reunions, going to her cousins wedding, and having a wonderful time together??? Where is the research on all of these things....????

    ...and that is why I am totally suspicious of any "research" these people, who have some vendetta to get Ed come up with.
    My gosh, this has nothing to do with Reid. This is about Ed and Ed alone. I am not sure why there's all this fights about true or false stories. Either you believe or you don't. If you don't believe the stories fine but don't judge those that do or blame Reid for being a "Saint". Why Reid, why not Kip, or Michael or any of the other guys? The fact is there's no story out there about Reid and two/three/4th timing babes and even if there was, it wouldn't mean much 'cos he's not F1. The only person that is generating all of these rumors is Ed and Ed alone.

  10. #500
    FORT Fogey
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    Re: Last Words ... Bachelorette 5

    I don't think anyone set out to expose Ed. These rumors have been swirling since the start practically. As far as I know no one has researched it so much as these emails became available. I don't think anyone hacked into to anything to expose secret emails. I have no idea if they actually exist, or, if they do, they are valid, but as far as I can see, no one went out of their way to find them initially.

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