Editing Analysis

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Originally Posted by IrishGal;3895220;

Bloomers? Can you tell me how many seasons back the edit patterns go? I was a faithful fan til Lorenzo, I just couldn't watch him. I only returned in Jake's season. So I have missed many of the seasons you reference. Curious if things changed in terms of edit at some point?

Many thanks for your expertise on this!

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It seems to me that up through Brad's season, there were some general trends. For instance, we frequently saw the F1's one on one date in the last episode before HT. Moreover, it wasn't that unusual to see what was called a "stealth" F1 which means that while we saw this girl here and there, the focus seemed to be on everyone but her until her 1-1 date right before HTs. At that point, the edit kicked in and we saw her story build rapidly until the FRC.

Also, one of the clues that helped me right at the end tie down the F1 was who visited the Parents first. Up through Brad's season, I believe it was the F1 who always visited the Parents first.(That was the way it was with the Bachelor. With the guys, it was just the opposite - the F2 went first always).

Often, the F1's HT visit was shown 3rd out of the 4 visits.

Oh! When I was looking back through I guess you'd call it the archives, what I noticed was that those trends seemed to begin to really form around Bob's season.

But after Brad chose no one, there was a huge change in the edit. Of course, it became much more sensationalized. Fleiss made no bones about it. He came out and said (paraphrased but correct) that trash sells reality TV.

Other changes included the earlier emphasis on the F1 with both the 1-1 date and the worse edit.
Who visits the Parents first flips from season to season now.

Those are some things I can think of off the top of my head, but as we get into the show and other things come up, I'm sure they will be mentioned.

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Originally Posted by CashFoSho;3895232;

I'm no edit expert, but I think the edits changed somewhere between Brad's season and Matt's season. They got new editors, Martin Hilton teamed up with Fleiss, and things changed a bit.

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You're right, and the changes were so significant that I thought there were new editors. I was corrected by someone and told that they were the same ones. I guess they must have had a major pow-wow and decided to move in different direction with the editing.

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Originally Posted by Bloomers;3895236;

You're right, and the changes were so significant that I thought there were new editors. I was corrected by someone and told that they were the same ones. I guess they must have had a major pow-wow and decided to move in different direction with the editing.

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The change in the editing also came with a new head writer for the show.

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Originally Posted by BlondieGal;3895321;

The change in the editing also came with a new head writer for the show.

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Thanks, Blondie! That may be the key. To me the changes were so significant I just naturally thought they were new editors!

On another note...after sleeping on it, I remember another previous pattern that we don't see as distinctly now as before Matt's season, and that is the connections made with the F4 at the M&G.
Previously, there was always either a physical, emotional, or physical/emotional connection made with each of the F4 either during the limo exit or the conversation at the M&G. Now, those connections are much less distinct or sometimes don't even exist as in the case of Melissa whom we didn't even see have a discussion with Jason at the M&G.
Also, now to confuse the issue, other contestants as well sometimes have as meaningful conversations as the F4s.
A prime example is the conversation between Jake and Corrie at the M&G where she questioned his values. Now, while it might be true that the edit was trying to show us some kinds of discrepancies in Jake, it is also true that the conversation they held in earlier seasons would have most definitely indicated an emotional bond and connection made between them.

Hmmm..speaking of trends?

Deanna's season - Graham has a 1-1 date in Episode 2 and he leaves at the end of the HTs.

Jake's season - Ali has a 1-1 date in Episode 2 and she leaves at the end of the HTs.

Ali's season - Frank has a 1-1 date in Episode 2 and he leaves before spending the night in the Fantasy Suite.

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Originally Posted by Bloomers;3900573;

Hmmm..speaking of trends?

Deanna's season - Graham has a 1-1 date in Episode 2 and he leaves at the end of the HTs.

Jake's season - Ali has a 1-1 date in Episode 2 and she leaves at the end of the HTs.

Ali's season - Frank has a 1-1 date in Episode 2 and he leaves before spending the night in the Fantasy Suite.

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Well, at least we KNOW that the tradition of the past few seasons has definitely been broken. Frank, the first 1:1 date recipient, will not be the next Bachelor/ette, like Jillian, Jake and Ali was.

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Originally Posted by n4692u;3900623;

Well, at least we KNOW that the tradition of the past few seasons has definitely been broken. Frank, the first 1:1 date recipient, will not be the next Bachelor/ette, like Jillian, Jake and Ali was.

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The next question is if the F1 trend will continue and Roberto is our man since he did the rope walking vs. Chris who did a B-Day Concert date. Bloomers, would love your opinion on this. And looks like the Forters were spot on with most everything including Roberto and Chris as F2!

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Originally Posted by debt2dreams;3900660;

The next question is if the F1 trend will continue and Roberto is our man since he did the rope walking vs. Chris who did a B-Day Concert date. Bloomers, would love your opinion on this. And looks like the Forters were spot on with most everything including Roberto and Chris as F2!

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Editwise, here is what we have, but remember that in both of the Bachelorette seasons, we have guys the Bachette definitely liked who bailed out on their own. We know for a certainity that in Deanna's season it changed things because she told it herself. With Ali all we have at this point is speculation.

In Matt's season there were no 1-1s during Ep.2.

Shayne got the wine date during Ep.3
Amanda got the 50s F3 Ep. 4 date.
Chelsey F2 and Noelle F4 got Ep.5 dates.

In Deanna's season that 2nd episode date (by her admission) belonged to the intended F1 Graham.
F2Jason, the single parent, who was intended to be F4 got the 3rd Ep. 1-1.
The 4th episode concert date was intended F3 Jesse.
F3 Jeremy, who was intended to be F2, got the 5th Ep. date

In Jason's season the 2nd episode went to F1 Melissa.
The 2nd episode concert date went to F3 Jillian.
(Single parent Stephanie gets a 1-1 during ep.3 like Jason)
The 4th episode cookout date went to F2 Mollie.
The 5th episode date went to F4 Naomi
F1 Melissa gets a second 1-1 during ep. 5 in Seattle.

In Jillian's season the 2nd episode concert date went to Jake. Something went awry there, but since they got one of the F4 dates (Wes) out of it, they were OK.

3rd episode 1-1 adventure date went to F1 Ed.
4th episode cook date went to F2 Kip.
6th episode 1-1 went to F3 Reid.

In Jake's season F4 Ali got the concert date.
F1 Vienna got the adventure date
( Single parent Ella also got a 1-1.)
F3 Gia gets the campout date during episode 4.
F2 Tenley gets SF date during ep. 5.
F4 Ali gets a second 1-1 during Ep.5 in SF.


In looking at the edit trends of the new storywriter(s) since Matt's season, I would have to guess that Chris with a date during the 4th episode was NOT Ali's original intended F1 before the shake-up.
Now, it may be a situation like happened with Deanna after the HTs where DeAnna had her mind made up who was going to be what, and Graham bailed out (we later were told by inside that it was mentioned to him sometime during the HT week that if he made it to the FRC that he would be expected to propose). During the next few weeks, DeAnna rearranged the order to what we know it as now.

I am speculating, purely and simply, but I would guess that based on the past seasons, Chris was originally intended to be either F3 or F2 at least up to the point that Frank bailed out.

I hate to say this, but I have to ask. If Frank broke up with his girl the day before he left, and he showed reluctance earlier than the night of the FD, is it possible that the producers talked Frank in to doing the Bachelor?

**If so, then they knew what storyline they wanted, and they set it up to happen. I think it might be an idea. He could have been a preconceived F3. :shrug

We know now that they recruited Graham hard. He really wasn't that interested, and we saw what happened. :(

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Originally Posted by Bloomers;3900780;

Editwise, here is what we have, but remember that in both of the Bachelorette seasons, we have guys the Bachette definitely liked who bailed out on their own. We know for a certainity that in Deanna's season it changed things because she told it herself. With Ali all we have at this point is speculation.

In Matt's season there were no 1-1s during Ep.2.

Shayne got the wine date during Ep.3
Amanda got the 50s F3 Ep. 4 date.
Chelsey F2 and Noelle F4 got Ep.5 dates.

In Deanna's season that 2nd episode date (by her admission) belonged to the intended F1 Graham.
F2Jason, the single parent, who was intended to be F4 got the 3rd Ep. 1-1.
The 4th episode concert date was intended F3 Jesse.
F3 Jeremy, who was intended to be F2, got the 5th Ep. date

In Jason's season the 2nd episode went to F1 Melissa.
The 2nd episode concert date went to F3 Jillian.
(Single parent Stephanie gets a 1-1 during ep.3 like Jason)
The 4th episode cookout date went to F2 Mollie.
The 5th episode date went to F4 Naomi
F1 Melissa gets a second 1-1 during ep. 5 in Seattle.

In Jillian's season the 2nd episode concert date went to Jake. Something went awry there, but since they got one of the F4 dates (Wes) out of it, they were OK.

3rd episode 1-1 adventure date went to F1 Ed.
4th episode cook date went to F2 Kip.
6th episode 1-1 went to F3 Reid.

In Jake's season F4 Ali got the concert date.
F1 Vienna got the adventure date
( Single parent Ella also got a 1-1.)
F3 Gia gets the campout date during episode 4.
F2 Tenley gets SF date during ep. 5.
F4 Ali gets a second 1-1 during Ep.5 in SF.


In looking at the edit trends of the new storywriter(s) since Matt's season, I would have to guess that Chris with a date during the 4th episode was NOT Ali's original intended F1 before the shake-up.
Now, it may be a situation like happened with Deanna after the HTs where DeAnna had her mind made up who was going to be what, and Graham bailed out (we later were told by inside that it was mentioned to him sometime during the HT week that if he made it to the FRC that he would be expected to propose). During the next few weeks, DeAnna rearranged the order to what we know it as now.

I am speculating, purely and simply, but I would guess that based on the past seasons, Chris was originally intended to be either F3 or F2 at least up to the point that Frank bailed out.

I hate to say this, but I have to ask. If Frank broke up with his girl the day before he left, and he showed reluctance earlier than the night of the FD, is it possible that the producers talked Frank in to doing the Bachelor?

**If so, then they knew what storyline they wanted, and they set it up to happen. I think it might be an idea. He could have been a preconceived F3. :shrug

We know now that they recruited Graham hard. He really wasn't that interested, and we saw what happened. :(

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Great post, Bloomers. Though I do wonder who would want to watch Frank as a Bachelor after this whole thing. I think MF would lose a lot of viewers going with the guy who left Ali standing at F3 because of a girlfriend, unless of course they edit the show to leave the gf detail out of it.

It really doesnt go to the edit, but it kinda does - remember Jake said in an interview that if they had 'held a gun to his head at F4, he would've picked Ali"? Although she got an episode 2 date, she also got a second 1:1 personal tour of her city date - which is where we saw the disconnect from her when they talked about Vienna.