Graham **SPOILERS**

[albean99]

I think Graham is trying really hard to give DeAnna what she wants but he also wants something he can't have which is a reassurance it's only him. She can't do that in this show. I still would pick Graham to go all the way if we didn't know better so do wonder if the rumor that he chooses to leave is true. If true, it's hard to see her falling for someone else so soon so maybe they're hiding something with her f1. I don't see the chemistry with Jason but she does care for him. Jesse I don't see at all.

[Google]

 

[SweetElvira]

Originally Posted by pajamasam

SweetElvira I agree with your point. But I also see the flip side. It may be easy enough to commit to being one of 25 until you realize that you've got real feelings for the girl. The reality must have been mighty different than what he imagined.

When Graham was telling De how difficult it was (at the track) and her reaction was one of hurt I was surprised. She might just as easily have been flattered that it meant that he really cared about her. I keep expecting her to be more understanding of how difficult it is for the men to share. But after last night , I see that it seems to just bring out a bit of panic in her heart. I see her now as frightened, not controlling. In a way - she was right to be so concerned.

I think that once Graham leaves, she will make her peace with it and finally have the chance to give the remaining men her full attention. She's already got some serious chemistry with Jason. I imagine that the fantasy date will open her eyes and heart to that possibility. If she did not have that chemistry with Jason at the start then I would assume that she fell for Graham and only Graham. But the one on one with Jason and their subsequent interactions have been very romantic and endearing. I do agree that you need to have that chemistry from the get go. I just think she had it with more than Graham.

Perhaps De's problem was that she had a surplus of candidates with whom to fall in love.

I wish Graham well and hope he finds love soon as well. He seems like a terrific guy.

Thanks for making me think about this more broadly, PJ. But my gut reaction -- the word that flashed into my mind when Graham had his hissy fit at the racetrack -- was "selfish." I'm sticking with it.

I think we've all gotten ourselves into situations that weren't what we expected and have been difficult to deal with. At least I have, and way too often. But by time a person is around 30, and Graham is 29, they should have figured out how to manage such mistakes. Graham isn't managing his frustration with this situation, he's trying to dump it all back on Dee. And it's self-defeating, because if he took a different tack, he might run away with this thing. Instead, through his behavior he's opening the door for Jason to surpass him. Jason brings less heat, but he brings enough that his other behaviors are enhanced, and he becomes really the only choice for Dee. As you say, PJ, she's falling for more than one man. Spending precious alone time fussing about it instead of trying to make a stronger impression is a foolish waste.

I completely understand not wanting to share in a dating situation. I never wanted to date guys who were dating around and was pretty neurotic about it myself. So being like that myself, I do not understand at all why someone who feels similarly would go on either the Bach or the B'ette. It's masochistic. And, in Graham's case, it brings out bad behavior. (YMMV on this one, of course.)

Also, as some others have pointed out, he isn't into her all that much to begin with. As Ron said, the one she wants is still there, and the one she picks is still there. I'm seeing her realize that the one she thinks she wants isn't as good as the one she picks.

[albean99]

I actually thought it was Dee who was selfish because it seemed like she wanted Graham to perform (kiss her) when they first got there. I wonder how it would have turned out if she didn't do that? I imagine that it must be confusing to think you have something special with her then see her seemingly do the same thing with the other guys. Makes you want to pull back. Of course those of us who've watched the show for a long time realizes that's normal and the best thing to do is not think about it during your alone time. I kind of doubt that most of these guys have seen the Bachelorette before unless a girlfriend forced them, lol.

I'd probably go with my heart if I were DeAnna but it may not be up to her since this guy isn't playing along with the game.

[KesaiSerris]

Am I the only one who wonders if it wouldn't be in the shows interest to make use of the rumors and sites like myspace and facebook as well as even leaking out misleading pics? I mean people are going to speculate and there's always rumors why not use it to their advantage to mislead? I know I've seen pics of scenes I don't recall seeing later on the aired show.

On another note I've wondered about this, sweet and nice guys "Fred" Brian" tend to get nixed in the show. My theory is this. Either the Bachelor/Bacherlorette gets swept away by the intensity and drama and so those laid-back sweet people just don't shine bright enough so to speak so they get overlooked b/c of the heat of the moment and all the lust (no one can tell me Deanna isn't lusting for Graham whether its deeper or not, she wants him lol) or the producers don't think those people add enough drama and so they get nixed b/c they aren't good for reality TV and the exaggerated style of American television in general, I mean seriously sometimes it doesn't make sense why they go. Remember Gwen a long time ago? Sometimes its just weird....

Does anyone remember in the very beginning of this season it might've been the first episode, it had a preview of Deanna rejecting a guy, I believe her reasons were he got attached too fast, was too clingy or something. That was ages ago so I may be wrong but its been lingering in mind and after seeing her and Jeremy that's my guess of who it is (if it happened lol), which explains the teary-eyes snapshots we've got of him. It just sort of reminds me of Robin, Matt was so close to her the other girls were envious but he went on liking her and then suddenly it was like a switch went off and he got tired of her or something. I think that might happen to Jeremy.

In reference to Graham in what I've seen of the bachelor/bachelorette the rocky passionate relationships do last to the end from what little I have seen. I mean remember Shayne? There was some fighting b/w her and Matt and for a while he was totally suspicious of her motives. I am not saying Graham will win but I am just saying sometimes it doesn't start off seeming a match made in heaven.

Also just b/c Graham didn't kiss her doesn't mean he doesn't like her. In America we tend to think guys want sex all the time and that they'd never turn down an opportunity with a girl they like even if the moment was all wrong. The boy was troubled and the way Deanna acted then seemed like she didn't care what he had to say she just wanted to snog him. No offense to anyone but I wouldn't have wanted to kiss her then either, I mean the moment was just bizarre him trying to be serious and her wanting to jump him

I'm new btw

Sorry it got long

[knobbyknee]

Originally Posted by albean99

I actually thought it was Dee who was selfish because it seemed like she wanted Graham to perform (kiss her) when they first got there. I wonder how it would have turned out if she didn't do that? I imagine that it must be confusing to think you have something special with her then see her seemingly do the same thing with the other guys. Makes you want to pull back. Of course those of us who've watched the show for a long time realizes that's normal and the best thing to do is not think about it during your alone time. I kind of doubt that most of these guys have seen the Bachelorette before unless a girlfriend forced them, lol.

I'd probably go with my heart if I were DeAnna but it may not be up to her since this guy isn't playing along with the game.

Bingo! I thought that De acted like a DIVA! Everyone should bow down and treat her like a princess. When she didn't receive all of the attention she lost it. I was totally put off.

[albean99]

Does anyone remember in the very beginning of this season it might've been the first episode, it had a preview of Deanna rejecting a guy, I believe her reasons were he got attached too fast, was too clingy or something. That was ages ago so I may be wrong but its been lingering in mind and after seeing her and Jeremy that's my guess of who it is (if it happened lol), which explains the teary-eyes snapshots we've got of him.

It was Fred that was in the previews. She was wearing the same top as the 2-1 date this week.

I'd love to think that Graham stays longer than f4 but there's no SC that show him in a FD or LCD so I doubt it happens.

[FanOfUnrealTV]

Originally Posted by albean99

I actually thought it was Dee who was selfish because it seemed like she wanted Graham to perform (kiss her) when they first got there.

It was just the reverse of the situation with Robert when he tried to kiss her and she pointed to her cheek: It wasn't a romantic moment, so why would Graham kiss her right then?

[MissMilano]

Originally Posted by emusha

Transcript for latest graham and Deanna @ RC

G: So talk to me. What's going through your mind?
D: Hurt by our conversation the other day at the racetrack... Uhm...
G: I know that, I don't verbalize things so well...And that is why I kind of just did what I did. I knew you were upset, and so you should be. But it was good to know that seeing you like that caused me pain, because... I care about you. And I hope that means something to you.
D: It does mean something. (we see Graham's lips go into a little smile at this point, him trying to maintain eye contact while she looks down, to the side then back at him as she continues to say) But I think in the short amount of time that we do get together that its just about me and you. If it is 15mins together, that will be 15mins together (at this point Graham starts to nod, still looking at her eyes) and not about (G: Right), the fact that I have connections with other guys or anything like that (G, nodding looking straight into her eyes) <pause>
G: I agree...no...I agree. I know that your emotions are not a light switch and you can't turn them off or on. But, I am hoping, in some minor way they changed a little bit by my concern.
D: I don't ever wanna be confused ...as to why you are here. (at this point she is looking straight into his eyes) <small pause>
G: I am here for you. (with a somewhat 'you shouldn't even question that' expression, he seems surprised by the question. there's a little reflection from his left eye, he nods) D: ok. (more nodding) D: ..k. (they kiss)

I think these two are talking about two completely different things. She's talking about his behavior at the racetrack and trying to tell him he hurt her, he should be attentive to her because along the way nothing should take away from their private time together. She is asking him to give her all of him when they have time together... while he's trying to explain his motives behind his action and to tell her that he cares, that he is in this emotionally. But more so he's asking her implicitly: Does she care as well? have her emotions changed a little bit because of her knowing it's painful for him to watch her with other men. Does it matter to her that he cares for her? He's seeking her reassurance. This interaction showed me he laid it out on the line but maybe that was not so clear to her because of the mixed signals (which happened since he feels very guarded [as he said] about laying it all out there).
What he should have said imo is: i did what i did because i am falling for you (though i find that hard to verbalize) and it hurts me to see you with the other men, does that make any difference to how you feel about me when you know that it hurts me like this? Do your emotions change?

I think his whole act this episode was a way to figure out whether Dee felt anything for him different from the other men because he "can't get past thinking she has shared something he thought was very special with other people". Though, it is hardly fair to her since she has to divide her attention as well as affection amongst the other men to make it fair, and because she doesn't know them very well yet.

emusha - wonderful post. I bolded what I think is the crux of the issue with Graham and Dee - communication. They are talking apples and oranges above. Like I think SweetElvira said, Graham wants assurance that he is the one and Dee just can't give him that. All she can do is be with him in the moments they have together, and that is waht she is asking from Graham. Also, this is what she is getting from Jason, Jesse and Jeremy at this point, so she is frustrated that Graham is having such issues. I like Graham, but even if he had stayed and ended up as F1, I see this going the way of Andy and Tessa - not lasting too long because of the differences in personality and style. I think Graham would have a horrible time coping with seeing Dee's observatory date with Jason, his comforting her and who knows what happens at FD, if he had ended up F1.

[itsyourmom]

Originally Posted by FanOfUnrealTV

It was just the reverse of the situation with Robert when he tried to kiss her and she pointed to her cheek: It wasn't a romantic moment, so why would Graham kiss her right then?

I agree that it was just the wrong moment. It looks like she desperately wants him to be the right one, and he just isn't (for whatever reason).

[pajamasam]

I'm seeing her realize that the one she thinks she wants isn't as good as the one she picks.

Ah Elvira, thank you for that lovely summation. Yes, she figures out that Graham isnt as into her as she had hoped. Her fairy tale is just not going to happen with him. And De, like Trista, realizes that there is a gem in her midst .