Thread: Reality Steve discussion only **Spoilers**

  1. #10441
    Fort Regular vintonmom's Avatar
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    I'm curious. Let's say what RS says is true. Jason and Mel split. But he states he doesn't know the reasons, and that Jason and Molly are now dating. This all happened in January. OK. First of all, let's assume that RS is telling the truth "AS HE KNOWS IT", or as he was told by his sources. Who are his sources? It's got to be someone on the set or that knows someone. So it's basically heresay. There's no proof other than RS trusts his sources. I don't doubt he's telling the truth, but are his sources?? And what is their motive? Anyone spotted Molly and J ?
    So now everyone is jumping on board with the idea that everyone knew from the beginning, it was all scripted and planned. Jason fell for Molly early on and yet went along with the idea of proposing to Mel and then dumping her. I'm just not buying it. Not only would that be out of character for everyone involved (given their character is as betrayed) but you can't hide chemistry. Not to mention, if Jason was so in love with Molly, he would not have been getting hot and heavy with Jillian in the hot tub. Or kissing every girl as often as he possilbly could. Yes, he had to put on a good act, but the hottub scene was not acting. Geez, my tv screen was steamed up. And he could have just as easily spent his time with them talking and being flirty, without all of the hot and heavy. Forget about editing, you could tell early on that Jason had the hots for Mel. Even if it was just lust and not actual feelings going on, Molly had to of noticed it and been jealous. A man in love does not act like he was acting, and let's face it, jason is not an actor.

    Next point. This season has been ho hum boring. We all knew from the beginning that Mel was F1. Not just from the sc but from the obvious chemistry b/w them. If there was editing done with Jason and Molly, so be it. The scenes that were shown were enough for most people to see that it was not great chemistry going on and there didn't appear to be a love story growing. What better way to keep people's attention than to start a rumor, a very good rumor, and tell Jason he has to end his engagement, or pretend to at least. The powers that be change his myspace page, schedule a 2nd show, and viola!! people are interested again. They have something to talk about. They'll be tuning in to watch rather they want to or not because curiousity will kill them. Perhaps it was all planned from the beginning because everyone could see that Jason wanted Melissa, so to throw everyone off, put out the sc and let them know who wins, but take it away last minute and make them all pissed. Then, have them "reunite".
    I know I'm reaching here, but there's just so much that doesn't make sense. And like others have said, what about the legal aspect? There's no way Fleiss would allow Jason and Molly to break their contracts. Never let anyone else before. But they could fly the girls into CA for meetings, and say they were meeting Jason. Cause a stir. How devious would this be??

  2. #10442
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    Ok, my friends, I spent the last hour reading the Bachelor form contract and I'm going to give you my thoughts. If you hate all things lawyer, or this bores you to death, please skip this note.
    * There are two schools of thought in drafting contracts - the one advanced by Thomas Jefferson and friends (wherefore, premises considered...) and people who have defended contracts after 1990 (plain English). The Bachelor contract fits into the first category, which means it is exceedlngly "gray," "dense" and hard to understand.
    * the thing that many people don't understand about corporate America is that most big companies are not nearly as smart or powerful as one might think. Like anyone else, they have budget constraints and never does anyone say, "let's throw some money at the legal department!"
    - the legal department is a backwater to the "revenue generating" divisions, poorly staffed and, comparatively speaking, not that well paid. Contracts, being the most mundane of tasks, fall to the youngest and least seasoned attorneys. That's why most big company contracts read like gibberish...this one is no exception.
    - contracts are usually forms, which are recycled forever, cut and paste, by the 1st or 2nd year idiots told to prepare them, and so they are infrequently updated to adhere to current legal requirements, and rarely does anyone look at them to ask if they really make sense.
    - the real value of a contract is that in all that legalese, there is something that some stiffy can point to and scare someone, but the actual piece of paper is often worthless.
    * provisions of interest in the Bachelor contract:
    - the parties are the person and "Syndicated Productions, Inc." No mention of ABC or whoever else is involved in the production of this show. Bad, because if you're not mentioned, you can't sue to enforce it.
    - lots of releases of future problems that may arise - generally unenforceable because you can't release something unknown to you.
    - retains control of all publicity, interviews, etc for one year following the FRC - this means that they have to approve interviews such as those we've read of Shannon, Naomi, etc. - which makes their content interesting.
    - refers to an "Honorarium" paid to participants for agreeing to all of this, but the amount is not specified
    - "Indemnification" language out of the 19th century - not valid in most states, including California, because it is not CONSPICUOUS and is fatally vague.
    - liquidated damages provision specifies that Syndicated Productions has damages of more than $5 million if confidentiality breached. This provision has to be tied to some real loss, can't just pick a number, or it's unenforceable.
    - sole remedy is arbitration...this goes both ways. In other words, Syndicated Productions can't just file suit. They have to go through the steps to take it to arbitration. Pretty weak enforcement mechanism.

    **** The point of what I'm saying is that I read a lot of stuff on the board about ABC and their team of lawyers, and why people couldn't do something because of this contract...and it's all fiction. The contract is crap and the lawyers are weak, and never has ABC effectively enforced this document, because, well, good luck trying.

  3. #10443
    FORT Fanatic mommyluvsnoah's Avatar
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by just logic;3335909;
    I'll watch the ATFR and if it unfolds the way RS states then I will bring the rope (not actually). Until then, I'm keeping an open mind.
    Completely understand keeping an open mind. Only problem with the rest of this though that Fliess has a couple of weeks at this point to edit the heck out of ATFR so it may resemble very little of what RS says other then Jason ends up with Molly at the end of it.

  4. #10444
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    To add to Bloomer's comment on the contract, I read Trista's from 2002 (it's on Smoking Gun.com, I can't post links here yet) and on page 16 it says she agrees not to date or enter any dating relationship from the day she signs the agreement until two weeks after the final episode airs.

    On the other hand, a contract can always be modified with the written consent of both parties.

    But I'd say the theories floating around that Melissa broke it off to go back with her ex-boyfriend are wrong. If the dust-up this week makes them edit the ATFR show to show Melissa breaking up with Jason rather than the other way around, I think they are more likely use as a reason that she didn't want to move to Seattle, rather than she decided to go back to her old boyfriend.

  5. #10445
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by sdl;3335917;
    Ok, my friends, I spent the last hour reading the Bachelor form contract and I'm going to give you my thoughts. If you hate all things lawyer, or this bores you to death, please skip this note.
    * There are two schools of thought in drafting contracts - the one advanced by Thomas Jefferson and friends (wherefore, premises considered...) and people who have defended contracts after 1990 (plain English). The Bachelor contract fits into the first category, which means it is exceedlngly "gray," "dense" and hard to understand.
    * the thing that many people don't understand about corporate America is that most big companies are not nearly as smart or powerful as one might think. Like anyone else, they have budget constraints and never does anyone say, "let's throw some money at the legal department!"
    - the legal department is a backwater to the "revenue generating" divisions, poorly staffed and, comparatively speaking, not that well paid. Contracts, being the most mundane of tasks, fall to the youngest and least seasoned attorneys. That's why most big company contracts read like gibberish...this one is no exception.
    - contracts are usually forms, which are recycled forever, cut and paste, by the 1st or 2nd year idiots told to prepare them, and so they are infrequently updated to adhere to current legal requirements, and rarely does anyone look at them to ask if they really make sense.
    - the real value of a contract is that in all that legalese, there is something that some stiffy can point to and scare someone, but the actual piece of paper is often worthless.
    * provisions of interest in the Bachelor contract:
    - the parties are the person and "Syndicated Productions, Inc." No mention of ABC or whoever else is involved in the production of this show. Bad, because if you're not mentioned, you can't sue to enforce it.
    - lots of releases of future problems that may arise - generally unenforceable because you can't release something unknown to you.
    - retains control of all publicity, interviews, etc for one year following the FRC - this means that they have to approve interviews such as those we've read of Shannon, Naomi, etc. - which makes their content interesting.
    - refers to an "Honorarium" paid to participants for agreeing to all of this, but the amount is not specified
    - "Indemnification" language out of the 19th century - not valid in most states, including California, because it is not CONSPICUOUS and is fatally vague.
    - liquidated damages provision specifies that Syndicated Productions has damages of more than $5 million if confidentiality breached. This provision has to be tied to some real loss, can't just pick a number, or it's unenforceable.
    - sole remedy is arbitration...this goes both ways. In other words, Syndicated Productions can't just file suit. They have to go through the steps to take it to arbitration. Pretty weak enforcement mechanism.

    **** The point of what I'm saying is that I read a lot of stuff on the board about ABC and their team of lawyers, and why people couldn't do something because of this contract...and it's all fiction. The contract is crap and the lawyers are weak, and never has ABC effectively enforced this document, because, well, good luck trying.

  6. #10446
    FORT Fogey glowgirl's Avatar
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    Contract talk above is interesting. No wonder that Kate from Andy's season felt free to be candid.

  7. #10447
    FORT Fanatic Frak's Avatar
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by sclilred1;3335899;
    How exactly is any of this supposed to be proven? Does anyone really think that ABC will tell the truth about what has happened? Does anyone think that Fleiss will tell the truth? Who has something to gain by keeping the truth hidden? Fleiss can and does splice and dice things any way that he wants them for ratings and drama. It has already come into light that Fleiss took an answer by Amanda (from Matt's season) and took out the NOT in the sentence. Taking out that NOT made it into a completely different sentence meaning something completely different. That was just for the WTA episode, imagine what he does for the regular show.
    I get what you're saying, but what does that mean exactly? Because we'll never know, we should just believe anything we read? RS is probably right (who really knows), but what in the world did he say that we can take as fact? He didn't prove anything. He just says to watch and when it happens like he says, then we'll believe. But they won't show us the in between...and because he was right on the rest (which others could've guessed) we should just believe the rest of it? For all we know, he got word that J picked Melissa but broke up with her and is now with Molly and just theorized everything in between. Thing is, we'll never know. If you're a Melissa fan, you're probably more apt to believe it. If you're not, you may be more open to it being false. Just the way it goes. I'm trying not to go off on Jason, Fleiss or whomever without truly knowing anything. Actually, I have no problem with people going off on Fleiss; he deserves it. As for the rest, I'll hold off for the facts, thanks.

    ETA: On a completely unrelated note, I just saw a picture of Rihanna's face and I am disgusted by Chris Brown.

  8. #10448
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by sdl;3335917;
    Ok, my friends, I spent the last hour reading the Bachelor form contract and I'm going to give you my thoughts. If you hate all things lawyer, or this bores you to death, please skip this note.
    * There are two schools of thought in drafting contracts - the one advanced by Thomas Jefferson and friends (wherefore, premises considered...) and people who have defended contracts after 1990 (plain English). The Bachelor contract fits into the first category, which means it is exceedlngly "gray," "dense" and hard to understand.
    * the thing that many people don't understand about corporate America is that most big companies are not nearly as smart or powerful as one might think. Like anyone else, they have budget constraints and never does anyone say, "let's throw some money at the legal department!"
    - the legal department is a backwater to the "revenue generating" divisions, poorly staffed and, comparatively speaking, not that well paid. Contracts, being the most mundane of tasks, fall to the youngest and least seasoned attorneys. That's why most big company contracts read like gibberish...this one is no exception.
    - contracts are usually forms, which are recycled forever, cut and paste, by the 1st or 2nd year idiots told to prepare them, and so they are infrequently updated to adhere to current legal requirements, and rarely does anyone look at them to ask if they really make sense.
    - the real value of a contract is that in all that legalese, there is something that some stiffy can point to and scare someone, but the actual piece of paper is often worthless.
    * provisions of interest in the Bachelor contract:
    - the parties are the person and "Syndicated Productions, Inc." No mention of ABC or whoever else is involved in the production of this show. Bad, because if you're not mentioned, you can't sue to enforce it.
    - lots of releases of future problems that may arise - generally unenforceable because you can't release something unknown to you.
    - retains control of all publicity, interviews, etc for one year following the FRC - this means that they have to approve interviews such as those we've read of Shannon, Naomi, etc. - which makes their content interesting.
    - refers to an "Honorarium" paid to participants for agreeing to all of this, but the amount is not specified
    - "Indemnification" language out of the 19th century - not valid in most states, including California, because it is not CONSPICUOUS and is fatally vague.
    - liquidated damages provision specifies that Syndicated Productions has damages of more than $5 million if confidentiality breached. This provision has to be tied to some real loss, can't just pick a number, or it's unenforceable.
    - sole remedy is arbitration...this goes both ways. In other words, Syndicated Productions can't just file suit. They have to go through the steps to take it to arbitration. Pretty weak enforcement mechanism.

    **** The point of what I'm saying is that I read a lot of stuff on the board about ABC and their team of lawyers, and why people couldn't do something because of this contract...and it's all fiction. The contract is crap and the lawyers are weak, and never has ABC effectively enforced this document, because, well, good luck trying.


    Thanks for wading through that! As a former lawyer I am inclined to agree with you. Which is why I don't believe anyone can claim he or she was forced to do something because of the contract. No one's back was pushed that hard against a wall.

    Sorry, did that sound dirty?

  9. #10449
    FORT Fogey KashatheDiva's Avatar
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by xseannax;3335900;
    This could very well be true. I think some people are afraid to stand firm and cave into fears. Yes, he had a contract it is really hard to believe that a judge would find that they were able to enforce him LYING and carrying on a fake engagement(a verbal contract). Sure he could be forced to PUBLICLY say what he was told to say and still make all the required appearances, but privately is another matter. If it were me and I was told "we are staying here until you do this" everyone would still be in NZ waiting.
    I would have teleported myself outta there.
    But then--we didn't apply for the show either.
    I have to wonder about those who sell their souls.
    A dr. asked me: Does anyone in your family suffer from mental illness? My answer: No they all enjoy it immensely.

  10. #10450
    FORT Fogey glowgirl's Avatar
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    Re: RS Predictions **Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by ZulaMay;3335926;
    Thanks for wading through that! As a former lawyer I am inclined to agree with you. Which is why I don't believe anyone can claim he or she was forced to do something because of the contract. No one's back was pushed that hard against a wall.

    Sorry, did that sound dirty?

    Nah, mild compared to Molly's massage and those hot tub scenes.

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