Body, Lip and Facial Communication Bachelor 12 *SPOILERS*

[seniorgal]

Lynn, I am curious what you would say about Matt's voice as he gave Chelsa the rose. It could be lowered, almost a whisper, because he felt bad about leaving Noelle. I think if he was as serious about Chelsa as he says, his voice would have been clearer in spite of the last rose given.

[Google]

 

[heatheshells10]

I don't know what Lynn would say, but here's my opinion. Take note of my avatar, but I always try to post with as little of my bias influencing my post as possible. I actually had the opposite reaction to you. I thought the lower toned voice and the whisper he used with Chelsea was full of emotion and it struck me the way he said it. It could be, like you said, that it was because he knew he had to say goodbye to Noelle or it could be because he feels a lot for Chelsea and saw how upset she was becoming and how worried she was.

[ButterflyFaery]

Originally Posted by Lynn7

Wine: check (I slowed down; I seemed to be practically leading up to the show I was so anxious )
Comfy chair: check
Mr. Fabulous: check

First off. There's a ring! There's a ring!

First up, Shayne. Matt seemd a little disinterested earlier in the conversation with Shayne. He was looking away a fair bit, raising his eyebrows, even their greeting he didn't seem like he had anywhere near the kind of affection that he has indicated in the past. In fact, Matt had a more beaming smile when Mr. Hollywood walked in. When her dad said that, "her feelings are very important to me too," Shayne read as she didn't believe her dad. She loses all expression in her face, looks down and it reads as skeptical; disbelief. Shayne looked mortified that her dad brought up "wants to be a star" and when she said that she wanted to crawl up into a ball I believed her. When she started to get a little emotional trying to convince Matt and her dad that she's there for the right reasons Matt kind of patts her shoulder. I refer to this as the friend patt, take one for the team patt. Even when she put both of her hands near his, reading as asking for reassurance, he doesn't touch her hands and, instead, keeps his hands to himself. The talk that Matt had with Lorenzo seemed like Matt was desperately seeking 'something.' He blinks, he has his chin resting on his hand a couple of times and when he says, "It's almost too good to be true," he has his face in his and is looking down, almost looking wistful, it reads as recognition that 'it is' too good to be true and he's disappointed with the realization.

When Shayne says that it's time to go to her mom's place and she leans into him to hug him he has a very telling expression on his face. I'm hesitant to use this phraseology but it really reads like, "Good god, do we have to?" It's at the 8 minute mark. He leans his head back slightly, does a flinch kind of blink and seems to take in a slight breath.

Did she really say, "callment?" instead of 'comment?'

Good grief. Did her mother have *anything* that was real on her body? Scary. I guess, if this is what Matt wants in the future then her mom is a perfect example of how beauty can be destroyed by surgery. *sigh* The entire vibe changed completely between the two parents' visits. Things were so light and carefree while at the mom's house. If Shayne was trying to convince her father and Matt that she was 'here' for the right reasons then she might have told her mom not to bring out the family video which clearly shows a young lady who wants to be a 'star.' If anything, I would think it would reinforce, to Matt, that she does want to be a star. Pointed finger rubbing the brow while he's saying, "I was really intrigued to see her *mother*," (* emphasis) reads like he was a little floored and not in a positive way.

For those counting: 20 minutes into the show, including commercials and the date ends. I don't know how long it was without commercials.

Next up, Chelsea. Matt seemed so much at ease meeting Chelsea's family. His facial expressions were very relaxed. Lots of smiling eyes from Matt. Matt seemed uncomfortable, pensive, and so did her dad, awkward, when Chelsea says, "I could pull out of this just as easily mom," to which her mom answers, "that's true. His eyes get a little wide. Uhmm...nice voice over, "I've fallen in love with her," LOL while talking to her mom. His body language, left hand between crossed legs, fisted right hand under his chin, reads as very guarded and defensive. There was a really nice caring look in his eyes at a particular moment before they started kissing and, yet, when he gets in the SUV he seems like he is ready to go.

For those counting: 6 minutes of date time, excluding commercials.

Next up, Noelle. Thanks for NOT showing the cow Fleiss *hmph!* and thanks for NOT showing the flipping piggyback!! ARRGGHH!!

I don't really have much to say because we know she leaves. She seemed so open to him the first night and has become so much more guarded along the way. When Matt was telling them about settling down, and they were talking about marrying their best friend, Matt looks down, and then down a little more, nodding yes, and his whole expression seems as though he knows how important that is to him but it's not in the room. It's like an acknowledgement that Noelle isn't *that* person.

For those counting: 7 minutes of date time, excluding commercials.

Finally, Amanda.

Mr. Fabulous had no idea that the parents were actors until I told him. He found the whole thing gut wretching funny as did I. Matt really was trying hard with the fake parents despite how horrid they were toward him. There were so many moments where his expression indicated that he was thinking, "are these people for real?" as in questioning whether or not this was a joke or not. I loved how he guzzled his beer during the exchange in the livingroom; he was obviously a little overwhelmed I love how he kept looking over to the producers? like, "get me out of this!" At first Matt seemed shocked that she had pulled the prank but, later, after it seemed to sink in, he got a kick out of it. When they had their alone time together he is laying on the couch, completely open, surrendering himself to her. The stroking the hair was also tender. I didn't see the same bliss in his eyes but I did see the smiling eyes and there was a seriousness in his expression.

For those counting: 7 minutes of date time, excluding commercials.

I probably need to watch it again to get an even better read but, at this point, I'm still not sure what to think. The 'look' that he gave Chelsea for a moment there almost leads me to believe that he is masking his real affection for her and allowed me a glimpse. The time with Amanda reads like giving himself to her, completely. I didn't read anything concrete with Shayne this time so I don't know if he was SO nervous meeting her dad first up or if his feelings are beginning to wane.

Incidentally, this look is from the date with Amanda. People tried to convince me otherwise but...

Lynn..this is what I came up with during the show..I typed this in the show discussion area..sorry I was busy watching the clock and did not even think to count PI's

Now this is totally from the clock on my cable box ....so far

Shayne part 1 10:04 - 10:10 = 7 minutes

commerical

Shayne part 2 10:14 - 10:20 = 7 minutes

commerical

Chelsa 10:23 - 10:29 = 7 minutes ...he mentions falling in "love"

commerical

Noelle 10:33 - 10:40 = 7 minutes...again he mentions falling in "love"

commerical

Amanda 10:43 - 10:50 = 7 minutes and IMO...he LOVED the prank and I noticed a lot of tenderness between Matt and Amanda

[keg701]

Originally Posted by Lynn7

Wow, great minds think alike It read like surrender to me but submissive is just as accurate. Isn't that weird how we *both* saw the same thing during that moment?

Surrender was actually the word I was looking for, just could not think of it. I agree that it is interesting that the two of us who rely so much on body language, thought the same thing.

[luv4dummies]

Originally Posted by Lynn7

Wine: check (I slowed down; I seemed to be practically leading up to the show I was so anxious )
Comfy chair: check
Mr. Fabulous: check

First off. There's a ring! There's a ring!

First up, Shayne. Matt seemd a little disinterested earlier in the conversation with Shayne. He was looking away a fair bit, raising his eyebrows, even their greeting he didn't seem like he had anywhere near the kind of affection that he has indicated in the past. In fact, Matt had a more beaming smile when Mr. Hollywood walked in. When her dad said that, "her feelings are very important to me too," Shayne read as she didn't believe her dad. She loses all expression in her face, looks down and it reads as skeptical; disbelief. Shayne looked mortified that her dad brought up "wants to be a star" and when she said that she wanted to crawl up into a ball I believed her. When she started to get a little emotional trying to convince Matt and her dad that she's there for the right reasons Matt kind of patts her shoulder. I refer to this as the friend patt, take one for the team patt. Even when she put both of her hands near his, reading as asking for reassurance, he doesn't touch her hands and, instead, keeps his hands to himself. The talk that Matt had with Lorenzo seemed like Matt was desperately seeking 'something.' He blinks, he has his chin resting on his hand a couple of times and when he says, "It's almost too good to be true," he has his face in his and is looking down, almost looking wistful, it reads as recognition that 'it is' too good to be true and he's disappointed with the realization.

When Shayne says that it's time to go to her mom's place and she leans into him to hug him he has a very telling expression on his face. I'm hesitant to use this phraseology but it really reads like, "Good god, do we have to?" It's at the 8 minute mark. He leans his head back slightly, does a flinch kind of blink and seems to take in a slight breath.

Did she really say, "callment?" instead of 'comment?'

Good grief. Did her mother have *anything* that was real on her body? Scary. I guess, if this is what Matt wants in the future then her mom is a perfect example of how beauty can be destroyed by surgery. *sigh* The entire vibe changed completely between the two parents' visits. Things were so light and carefree while at the mom's house. If Shayne was trying to convince her father and Matt that she was 'here' for the right reasons then she might have told her mom not to bring out the family video which clearly shows a young lady who wants to be a 'star.' If anything, I would think it would reinforce, to Matt, that she does want to be a star. Pointed finger rubbing the brow while he's saying, "I was really intrigued to see her *mother*," (* emphasis) reads like he was a little floored and not in a positive way.

For those counting: 20 minutes into the show, including commercials and the date ends. I don't know how long it was without commercials.

Next up, Chelsea. Matt seemed so much at ease meeting Chelsea's family. His facial expressions were very relaxed. Lots of smiling eyes from Matt. Matt seemed uncomfortable, pensive, and so did her dad, awkward, when Chelsea says, "I could pull out of this just as easily mom," to which her mom answers, "that's true. His eyes get a little wide. Uhmm...nice voice over, "I've fallen in love with her," LOL while talking to her mom. His body language, left hand between crossed legs, fisted right hand under his chin, reads as very guarded and defensive. There was a really nice caring look in his eyes at a particular moment before they started kissing and, yet, when he gets in the SUV he seems like he is ready to go.

For those counting: 6 minutes of date time, excluding commercials.

Next up, Noelle. Thanks for NOT showing the cow Fleiss *hmph!* and thanks for NOT showing the flipping piggyback!! ARRGGHH!!

I don't really have much to say because we know she leaves. She seemed so open to him the first night and has become so much more guarded along the way. When Matt was telling them about settling down, and they were talking about marrying their best friend, Matt looks down, and then down a little more, nodding yes, and his whole expression seems as though he knows how important that is to him but it's not in the room. It's like an acknowledgement that Noelle isn't *that* person.

For those counting: 7 minutes of date time, excluding commercials.

Finally, Amanda.

Mr. Fabulous had no idea that the parents were actors until I told him. He found the whole thing gut wretching funny as did I. Matt really was trying hard with the fake parents despite how horrid they were toward him. There were so many moments where his expression indicated that he was thinking, "are these people for real?" as in questioning whether or not this was a joke or not. I loved how he guzzled his beer during the exchange in the livingroom; he was obviously a little overwhelmed I love how he kept looking over to the producers? like, "get me out of this!" At first Matt seemed shocked that she had pulled the prank but, later, after it seemed to sink in, he got a kick out of it. When they had their alone time together he is laying on the couch, completely open, surrendering himself to her. The stroking the hair was also tender. I didn't see the same bliss in his eyes but I did see the smiling eyes and there was a seriousness in his expression.

For those counting: 7 minutes of date time, excluding commercials.

I probably need to watch it again to get an even better read but, at this point, I'm still not sure what to think. The 'look' that he gave Chelsea for a moment there almost leads me to believe that he is masking his real affection for her and allowed me a glimpse. The time with Amanda reads like giving himself to her, completely. I didn't read anything concrete with Shayne this time so I don't know if he was SO nervous meeting her dad first up or if his feelings are beginning to wane.

Incidentally, this look is from the date with Amanda. People tried to convince me otherwise but...

Lynn7,
Thank you again for your input on the show. Your analysis is always an interesting read. I felt the same way after Chelsea's date last night, about how they looked at each other. I also agree with the Matt is into Amanda. I asked hubby who he would choose (only after last night) and he said ME LOL

[seniorgal]

Originally Posted by heatheshells10

I don't know what Lynn would say, but here's my opinion. Take note of my avatar, but I always try to post with as little of my bias influencing my post as possible. I actually had the opposite reaction to you. I thought the lower toned voice and the whisper he used with Chelsea was full of emotion and it struck me the way he said it. It could be, like you said, that it was because he knew he had to say goodbye to Noelle or it could be because he feels a lot for Chelsea and saw how upset she was becoming and how worried she was.

Yes, I do believe it could have been that he was trying to connect to Chelsa, with a soothing voice. It was my first reaction.

[AFrankR]

The other thing I noticed was the rose ceremony. With Shayne his arm extends farther out in distance to "hand" her the rose.
With Amanda and Chelsea, he continued to hold the rose close to his person when he gave them to those two.
Did anyone else notice that????

[keg701]

I saw that too! Thought it was weird that he was making her reach so far for the rose.

[nhromantic]

Originally Posted by AFrankR

The other thing I noticed was the rose ceremony. With Shayne his arm extends farther out in distance to "hand" her the rose.
With Amanda and Chelsea, he continued to hold the rose close to his person when he gave them to those two.
Did anyone else notice that????

Actually it looks to me like he didn't extend the rose to Shayne at all, but he did more so with Chelsea and Amanda.

[Lynn7]

Bringing this over from the Hands thread.

That's why I think it's important to find the matching elbow. Sheesh, me and my elbows this season In the elbow shot he is actually kneeling down to proposse. There's even a cap of her shoulder and it looks to be around the height of Amanda.