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Thread: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by hannelorea;2653730;
    True you did! I guess it just made me wonder...why did they edit it this way? It was very obvious...the pause, the biting of the lip. I realize he had other body language that demonstrated his feelings but that moment really stuck in my mind as I'm sure it did other viewers. Are they trying to create doubt in our minds (doubt of his love for DeAnna) or are they trying to throw us??

    Thanks also for your analysis, it's so interesting to read!
    I think, to the general viewer, that lip biting would prompt, "see, he's not into her, it's not her, he's biting his lip," being yelled at the TV screen. Ha, sorry, I don't know if people do this but I imagine it It could be that Fleiss is trying to create doubt because, like you say, why leave that in and make it so obvious that it sticks out to viewers.

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by Estella;2653757;
    Lynn7, I have a question for you: Brad's "toast" to Jenni at dinner (telling her he's been waiting for this from the moment he first talked to her...), do you think that was staged? To me, it seemed like he was reciting something by heart... Also what do you think about Brad lying straight on his back while Jenni is kissing him and caressing his face? Did it just come across so awkward, or do you as our body language expert also think Brad didn't exactly feel comfortable?
    Thanks in advance for answering...
    Well, I didn't take it as prescripted, as in Fleiss told him to say it, but he could have been thinking about what he was going to say to her, prior to dinner, formulating his thoughts, because it doesn't come across as gushy and giddy as his conversation with DeAnna.

    The thing that struck me is that Brad has this pattern of complimenting the women about various things when he knows he's going to send them home. For example, he did it several times on the first night with the women that were sent home. Then he did it with Michelle, "hang in there, you're tough, that's pretty attractive." With Hillary, "I think you are just an amazing person all around. You're beautiful, sweet, kind, sincere." With Jenni, "You're different in a really, really special way and I'm very thankful that you've come into my life." All were said with a non-commital type of expression.

    The laying on the bed looked awkward to me too. I believe I referred to it above. He's not even touching her and when he does it comes across as more friendly than loving. I believe he really does like Jenni. Her outgoing exuberance would be infectious to some people and I think he is one of them. But, I've seen the initial attraction slowly cooling over the weeks.

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynn7;2654568;
    The laying on the bed looked awkward to me too. I believe I referred to it above. He's not even touching her and when he does it comes across as more friendly than loving. I believe he really does like Jenni. Her outgoing exuberance would be infectious to some people and I think he is one of them. But, I've seen the initial attraction slowly cooling over the weeks.
    I thought it looked like he wanted to close the door- he had his right arm outstretched at times- other times his hand was on her face.

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by appiah01;2653939;
    He actually said yesterday on the radio that he and Bettina talked more after the cameras were gone and he said it was even more uncomfortable and weird than what we saw so obviously there was more to it because it was obvious that he liked her a lot before but switched it off mighty quickly.
    Hmmm...interesting. "When Bettina and I finally made it to the fantasy suite it was just so different. It was much more romantic, it was much more comfortable, much more easy, it felt right. And I'm looking over at her and she's (he pauses, trying to find the right words), I don't know, she's taking my breath away." Then we get the screen text from the hottub scene.

    It sure did switch off quickly. Brad strikes me as the kind of person who, he either likes you or he doesn't. If he decides he doesn't like you it's complete shutdown of feelings. As an example, I'm quite sure that he has never gotten back together with one of his exes. I don't know for sure that this is the case but I say that to try to explain what I'm trying to say. It doesn't mean that he doesn't like to hurt people it's just that he comes across, when he decides he's no longer invested, like it's a very easy decision whereas other people might show/express more turmoil and conflict.

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynn7;2654568;
    Well, I didn't take it as prescripted, as in Fleiss told him to say it, but he could have been thinking about what he was going to say to her, prior to dinner, formulating his thoughts, because it doesn't come across as gushy and giddy as his conversation with DeAnna.

    The thing that struck me is that Brad has this pattern of complimenting the women about various things when he knows he's going to send them home. For example, he did it several times on the first night with the women that were sent home. Then he did it with Michelle, "hang in there, you're tough, that's pretty attractive." With Hillary, "I think you are just an amazing person all around. You're beautiful, sweet, kind, sincere." With Jenni, "You're different in a really, really special way and I'm very thankful that you've come into my life." All were said with a non-commital type of expression.

    The laying on the bed looked awkward to me too. I believe I referred to it above. He's not even touching her and when he does it comes across as more friendly than loving. I believe he really does like Jenni. Her outgoing exuberance would be infectious to some people and I think he is one of them. But, I've seen the initial attraction slowly cooling over the weeks.
    Always interesting! I respect Brad's comments to the ladies as he genuine and polite manner. Would it have been better if he told Michelle she's really clutzy and boy she looks banged up! LOL!!! He is very generous with his compliments and appears to not like hurting the women. RE: the bed scene with Jenni... I found it very intimate the way they were laying down together and touching while talking. I also found it very respectful of Jenni as Brad knew this was being filmed for all to see. Again, would it have been better if he "jumped" her? lol! Fleiss had the hot tub covered by Bettina, the pool with DD and the bed with Jenni--Brad was very busy!

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Lynn7, thanks so much for all the time you put in to explain what you see. I have gone back to review with the sound off, keeping your points in mind, and it's a whole 'nother story!
    It is not flesh and blood but the heart which makes us fathers and sons- Johann Schiller ~and daughters.

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by OutsideLookinIn;2653984;
    Lynn7, thank you for the great analysis! I really don't mind reading your analysis whether it's long or short. The longer the better actually

    I've came up with the same conclusion as you did as I too study the body language and facial expression when watching Brad & Bettina. I just want to confirmed it with you to see if I'm right or not . I too doubted his explanation of not really knowing her in the end (it's very contradicting to me also) because I have seen Bettina gradually opening up to him all the way from the very first episode until the FD. For someone who's scared and guarded she DID try but maybe not hard enough for him and his expectations from her. For someone who's shy about her feelings towards him, I actually admired her courage when she said "by the end of our date I wanted you to kiss me... I wanted your hands on me... I want that...", as if she's giving him a "go" signal. For her probably that was HUGE and a big step already knowing there were cameras around and doing it in front of national tv. His "intense look" towards Bettina after giving the final rose to Deanna was not what I expected from him at all. I expected him to be more "sad" about letting her go quite honestly. I think Bettina was more in total "shock" and misread what she thought he felt towards her given how she responded riding away. Some questioned it for the lack of emotion and that she came across as cold. How do you see it Lynn7? Do you agree when people say that she probably didn't invest emotionally that's why there was also no emotion shown from her on her departure?

    I totally agree with you, never again interpret previews! LOL... It's not what it seems. I have to take note on that next time (if there's any) I watch TB.

    And yes, I did noticed that "yes" and the "wink" that Jenni gave to Deanna. It's interesting that the camera actually focuses it back to them after Brad & Bettina left. Wonder was that all about too. I only thing I can come up with about it is that maybe they don't like her or that they're glad that she's not in the picture anymore (competitiveness on their part) . Wonder what Brad thinks of that now.
    Thanks. I worry that I'm going to take up too much room if I go on and on

    Courage, exactly! She admitted, herself, that she 'sucks' at dating. It could very well be that, due to her upbringing, play hard to get, that she wrestles with that as opposed to opening up more and being her true self around men that she likes. She came across as competent and fairly well spoken when she wasn't around Brad. That tells me that she really wasn't lying when she said she 'sucked' at dating. Our parents are the designers of our personal blueprints that make us the adults that we become. For many adults, they follow the expectations of that blueprint and don't veer from it, not wanting to disappoint their parents. For other adults, there are conflicts with it because we want to be our own person, make good and bad choices so that we can learn for ourselves but struggle, at times, with disappointing our parents. I see Bettina as being in between these two.

    I, too, expected him to show more genuine sadness, because of how he had behaved toward her, the things that he said to her, how fumbling, blushing and tender he was. Even his, er, body responded to her during the gondola date.

    I didn't think that she came across as unfeeling or emotionless during her departure at all. She came across as composed but hurt, sad and shocked. That she didn't burst into tears actually said more to me than if she had. I find, that when the women burst into tears, it isn't so much that he let them go but more to do with the rejection they feel and embarrassment at having it televised. When you are in shock your emotions, everything, shuts down until, you can process it. I'm quite sure that she cried later, once it all sunk in. I think she did allow herself to be open to this process and really put her heart and feelings out there.
    Last edited by Lynn7; 11-07-2007 at 04:50 PM.

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by Minney;2654604;
    Always interesting! I respect Brad's comments to the ladies as he genuine and polite manner. Would it have been better if he told Michelle she's really clutzy and boy she looks banged up! LOL!!! He is very generous with his compliments and appears to not like hurting the women. RE: the bed scene with Jenni... I found it very intimate the way they were laying down together and touching while talking. I also found it very respectful of Jenni as Brad knew this was being filmed for all to see. Again, would it have been better if he "jumped" her? lol! Fleiss had the hot tub covered by Bettina, the pool with DD and the bed with Jenni--Brad was very busy!
    Ha! That would have been funny but, you're right, he's too polite to say something like that directly to the women.

    With respect to the compliments, while it's very polite, it's also a pattern with him. Just like he completely wrinkles up his forehead when he's concerned or doubtful, or raises his right eyebrow when he's sceptical...etc.

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    [QUOTE=Lynn7;2654649;]Thanks. I worry that I'm going to take up too much room if I go on and on

    I can only speak for myself, but I want you to go on and on. I learn so much from getting your point of view; it has helped me understand just as much as learning about editing and producer tricks.
    It is not flesh and blood but the heart which makes us fathers and sons- Johann Schiller ~and daughters.

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    Re: Body Language & Non Verbal Communication - *Spoilers*

    Quote Originally Posted by lyb5007;2654647;
    Lynn7, thanks so much for all the time you put in to explain what you see. I have gone back to review with the sound off, keeping your points in mind, and it's a whole 'nother story!
    It really is interesting how different things are when you watch it like that isn't it? I once said, back in the summer I believe, that Fleiss can edit and chop all he wants but he's got nothing on those of us who are deaf or hard of hearing because we're forced to watch for so much more in order to understand what is going on. Many times we see a completely different show than the hearing viewers.

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