2/27 Bchelor 16 The Exotic Dates **West Coast Spoilers**

[ilja]

I think that it was very gracious of Nicki to even allow Courtney to hug her after being eliminated, and I would be willing to bet that it took all Nicki could muster up in order to be that gracious!!! That hug was SO meant for Ben to see Courtney as this enlightened and changed woman!!!

Here is my theory on Kacie returning. The producers caught her in a very vunerable state of mind and talked her into returning in order to get "closure" from Ben. I suspect that Kacie did have a bad case of nerves and was wondering why she allowed herself to be talked into it by the time she got to Switzerland, though. However, I hope that she got the closure that she needed after seeing Ben's reaction to her telling him that Courtney "was in it to win it". Boy, did the wind go out of Ben's sails and burst his bubble. He was not the least bit receptive to hearing that, and he demonstrated just how pissed he was at Kacie at that very moment. The angry Ben that we saw in Ashley's season was back!!! That whole sequence was painful to watch....from Kacie's standpoint. But the producers got just what they wanted. They waited and sprung that on Ben right before the final rose ceremony....to screw with Ben's head a little more. Not only has Ben gotten played by Courtney, but the producers have done a good job of that as well. Can you say drama?

I am going to guess that by the time Courtney got to meet Ben's mother and sister that she had been sufficiently warned (scolded) by Ben to be on her best behavior, so I am not expecting his sister and mom to see what the other women saw. I actually think Courtney will most likely get the approval of his family, but I would be interested to hear what they think of her now that the show has aired.

Yeah I think she's going to be on her best behavior too with his family. We'll get to see the other side of Courtney again like we did at her parents' home.

There is this part of me that feels sorry for Courtney. As pretty as she is, I would really hate to be her if this season is a true reflection of how she treats others.

[Baby's Breath]

I swear you can be the nicest of people and go into this situation with the best of intentions, and somehow come out looking like a loo loo. It's like a trap. I don't know what happens exactly, but it reminds me of being in a doctor's office and having all of your words misconstrued to the point where you just give up. I much prefer to see the Women Tell All etc. and the out clips because that is when we get a real taste for everyone's personality. I loved the little snowman scene (Hans) with Nicki and Ben.

[AlwaysVeg]

well the commerical is indicating that Courtney will be at the WTA...but we all know how Fleiss likes to play head games with us...I will say this...if she does make an appearance it probably will be a very explosive WTA..probably one of the better ones than they have had....as for the ATFR if he chooses Courtney which I am positive of since ABC is really trying to redeem her in a bad way...BIG TIME...and I really have to wonder if they are still really together and that is why ABC is on such a mission to make her look better or if there is some serious problems in paradise....IMO the only way Ben can come out of this with any redemtion at all would be to dump her on public tv and tell her what a sorry POS she is for playing him

This brings up a lot of very interesting questions ... for which I have no answers! Why would ABC care about redeeming Courtney? They made no effort to redeem Vienna, nor did they care about how stupid Jake looked for choosing her and then how he behaved in the breakup show. If B & C are still really together, what does ABC care how she looked during the show? Ben bought her "apology," and that's all that matters, I would think, in their way of seeing things. If they're not still together (of course, all this is IF B picks C and not L), then it would make more sense that they'd want Courtney to appear just as we saw her throughout the show, because how could Ben keep someone who behaved the way she did, someone who was just out to win and didn't really love him. No need to redeem her then. I would much prefer that the whole apology and explanation that they showed last night is for purposes of making Ben seem even more foolish for falling for the biggest manipulation Courtney has pulled off so far. They've already made Ben look like a horndog frat boy over Courtney. Why redeem her (or him) now? I think it's just more of the same, super-sized!

[Fanny Mare]

I swear you can be the nicest of people and go into this situation with the best of intentions, and somehow come out looking like a loo loo. It's like a trap. I don't know what happens exactly, but it reminds me of being in a doctor's office and having all of your words misconstrued to the point where you just give up. I much prefer to see the Women Tell All etc. and the out clips because that is when we get a real taste for everyone's personality. I loved the little snowman scene (Hans) with Nicki and Ben.

I love the way you said, coming out looking like a loo loo.I loved the snowman , but how come we never got to see them making that, and really laughing and having fun. ?? I dont get it. They have hours and hours of footage, but dont choose to show anyone having fun.

[Babbred]

I haven't watched the show yet, but here are some quick thoughts after reading this thread.

What is rappeling? It's holding on for dear life while you walk down the side of a mountain and pray to whatever deity you worship that that rope doesn't break. I know, because I've done it. Simply being lowered by a rope doesn't count. That's a SEAL mission.

Denver has some great beaches! Just like my hometown of Dallas.

I remember when NASCAR Barbie was on Brad's season. Everybody gushed about what a perfect couple they were. The romance of the century. All I could think was, "This woman is used to flying in private jets, living in a mansion, and basically being treated like royalty. And she's going to give all that up to move half way across the country for some guy who owns his own business? Ain't happenin'" I wasn't surprised in the least when they broke up. And nothing has changed my opinion. She's already got Fleiss under her thumb because she convinced him to film her season in Charlotte. And this is the kind of woman who's going to give up everything for an ordinary life? I'll believe it when I see it.

Titanic--can't stand that movie. A former minister of mine summed it up: woman has brief fling then pines for her lover the rest of her life. In the process, she trashes her marriage to another man by saying she wants to be buried beside said lover. What happened to all those years of hard work, love, and committment in her marriage? What did her kids think when they heard Mom's last wish? Were they pleased that their mother never really cared for their father? Our entire congregation applauded when our pastor said this.

[Midol]

I love the way you said, coming out looking like a loo loo.I loved the snowman , but how come we never got to see them making that, and really laughing and having fun. ?? I dont get it. They have hours and hours of footage, but dont choose to show anyone having fun.

Having fun is equated with sane, normal people and we can't have that on this show...Everything must be exagerated, over the top, dramatic, amazing!!! Besides, if they showed that then we wouldn't have time for the "shocking" return and "warning" to Ben. By the way, how stupid is this making him out to be since despite I don't know how many warnings now?, he is still dragging the skank to the end to meet his mom and sister...the woman who has repeatedly stated that she does not get along with women and doesn't have women friends? They must really hate him!!!

[Fanny Mare]

I remember when NASCAR Barbie was on Brad's season. Everybody gushed about what a perfect couple they were. The romance of the century. All I could think was, "This woman is used to flying in private jets, living in a mansion, and basically being treated like royalty. And she's going to give all that up to move half way across the country for some guy who owns his own business? Ain't happenin'" I wasn't surprised in the least when they broke up. And nothing has changed my opinion. She's already got Fleiss under her thumb because she convinced him to film her season in Charlotte. And this is the kind of woman who's going to give up everything for an ordinary life? I'll believe it when I see it.

Really, I didnt think any woman would have the upper hand over Fleiss, and I never believed for ONE second that those two would ever make it. He was smitten from day one, and she was , well, not.

[jucamer]

Oh...That would be so cool!! They can put Patty in charge of all the dates. I can see her cussing up a storm.

Can you imagine what she would have done to Courtney? There would be no meat left on those skinny bones!

[Fanny Mare]

Having fun is equated with sane, normal people and we can't have that on this show...Everything must be exaggerated, over the top, dramatic, amazing!!! Besides, if they showed that then we wouldn't have time for the "shocking" return and "warning" to Ben. By the way, how stupid is this making him out to be since despite I don't know how many warnings now?, he is still dragging the skank to the end to meet his mom and sister...the woman who has repeatedly stated that she does not get along with women and doesn't have women friends? They must really hate him!!!

.

[Longhornfan]

This brings up a lot of very interesting questions ... for which I have no answers! Why would ABC care about redeeming Courtney? They made no effort to redeem Vienna, nor did they care about how stupid Jake looked for choosing her and then how he behaved in the breakup show. If B & C are still really together, what does ABC care how she looked during the show? Ben bought her "apology," and that's all that matters, I would think, in their way of seeing things. If they're not still together (of course, all this is IF B picks C and not L), then it would make more sense that they'd want Courtney to appear just as we saw her throughout the show, because how could Ben keep someone who behaved the way she did, someone who was just out to win and didn't really love him. No need to redeem her then. I would much prefer that the whole apology and explanation that they showed last night is for purposes of making Ben seem even more foolish for falling for the biggest manipulation Courtney has pulled off so far. They've already made Ben look like a horndog frat boy over Courtney. Why redeem her (or him) now? I think it's just more of the same, super-sized!

I could not have said it better....good post. That is exactly what I have been wondering. Why the need to redeem Courtney to the public, because let's be clear about this. If Courtney, as one of the F2, is given the opportunity to appear on the WTA in order to supposedly apologize to the other women, then there is more to this than we are seeing. Since when has Fleiss and company cared about what people think of these bachelors and bachelorettes?

What I am most afraid of is that Fleiss intends to blindside all of the bachelorettes in attendance in order to get some raw emotional footage when he trots Courtney out. It is my hope that all of these ladies were smart enough to NOT play into the producers' hands and didn't allow themselves to be exploited further for the sake of ratings. There seem to be some intelligent women among that group, and I am hoping that they have had enough time to realize just how much manipulation goes on in the editing room after seeing how they were portrayed.

I am interested in watching the WTA, but I have mixed feelings. I know that we will never get a straight answer, especially from Chris Harrison, as to why Courtney is so special that she has basically been given equal billing in Ben's season as the Bachelor, for we all know that this has essentially been the Courtney Show from the first episide on. I personally don't want her at the WTA to ruin that show for me as well, because it will once again be all about her!!! We won't even hear from most of the other women there unless they can add to the drama. I have seen enough of Courtney, and I am officially sick of her!!! I can't wait for this season to end. I can't stand either her or Ben anymore, and I hope that he did pick Courtney at the end.