1/16 Bachelor 16 Show Thread *West Coast Spoilers*

[jucamer]

Just watching the show again on my DVR...I like to do that after I read this thread to pick up the things I missed.

When Courtney comes striding across like an Amazon to get her rose, she pauses for an eternity, heaves a gusty sigh, pushes her hair back, and then goes into this spiel about "Tonight was a lot...it was heavy for me...I will, but thank you for not making me go through that [I guess she meant not wait to get the final rose]." OMG, that whole scene just screamed Sex Goddess proclaiming, "Slave, how dare you contemplate straying! I will punish you!" Totally agree with what everybody else has said. Forget spoilers, you can see a mile away whom he's going to pick.

Do you think so? I haven't read the spoilers so I haven't a clue who he picks, but the face and eye roll Ben made when Courtney was walking back from getting the rose told me maybe he saw a hint of the kook that we all see. What she said to him made NO sense "what's her butt", etc etc." It sounded like someone on drugs.

[veg_out]

Do you think so? I haven't read the spoilers so I haven't a clue who he picks, but the face and eye roll Ben made when Courtney was walking back from getting the rose told me maybe he saw a hint of the kook that we all see. What she said to him made NO sense "what's her butt", etc etc." It sounded like someone on drugs.

I hope to all that is good, sacred, and uncollagenated that you are right, juc. In watching it back with some distance, I do wonder if Ben's facial expression after her spiel was included to indicate his surprise--isn't Courtney supposed to be mellow and drama-free according to him?? Open your eyes, Ben. Wider.

[Edit for hint at possible spoiler]

[KatesMom]

What's odd is that Fleissmaster usually puts us through all these mind games so that we're trying to guess whom he/she will pick? Why are they letting it be so obvious? Are they really that out of ideas? Or was it so obvious in Ben's dates with other women that there wasn't much the producers could work with? Either way, it makes for a lame season. I'm just in it for the scenery now. (I love what somebody said about the girls just sticking it out for the trips. Can't blame 'em.

Just wanted to comment on this. When this has happened in the past it is usually one of two things - either the lead did not give the producers much to work with (think Ian/Merideth, Ashley/JP, Brad/Emily), or the editing is telling a story about what the producers think about the possible success of the relationship (think Ed/Jillian and Vienna/Jake). When there isn't a love story, or there isn't a conflict story to tell, the producers can only do so much - the rest is filler and created-drama to keep it interesting. I have a pretty good guess about who the F1 is, based on what we have seen so far. That being said, with Fleiss, anything is possible! Of that, we can be sure!

[Midol]

Just wanted to comment on this. When this has happened in the past it is usually one of two things - either the lead did not give the producers much to work with (think Ian/Merideth, Ashley/JP, Brad/Emily), or the editing is telling a story about what the producers think about the possible success of the relationship (think Ed/Jillian and Vienna/Jake). When there isn't a love story, or there isn't a conflict story to tell, the producers can only do so much - the rest is filler and created-drama to keep it interesting. I have a pretty good guess about who the F1 is, based on what we have seen so far. That being said, with Fleiss, anything is possible! Of that, we can be sure!

Love your post and so true. I personally love it when they throw in hints of how they think the relationship will end...And they are usually right since they know all there is to know about these people...the good, the bad and the ugly. Personally, I think they really like casting the bad and the ugly since it gives them such drama and brings out water cooler talk about the show. Not to mention, when the squeeky clean, oh so perfect person goes for that...yes, I'm thinking of Jake...they feel free to go crazy and expose the hypocracy in their own, wierd way!

[veg_out]

Just wanted to comment on this. When this has happened in the past it is usually one of two things - either the lead did not give the producers much to work with (think Ian/Merideth, Ashley/JP, Brad/Emily), or the editing is telling a story about what the producers think about the possible success of the relationship (think Ed/Jillian and Vienna/Jake). When there isn't a love story, or there isn't a conflict story to tell, the producers can only do so much - the rest is filler and created-drama to keep it interesting. I have a pretty good guess about who the F1 is, based on what we have seen so far. That being said, with Fleiss, anything is possible! Of that, we can be sure!

As Midol noted, such a good point! I remember Blondie reminding us of this tidbit back during Aliberto's season.

At this point, Blakeley seems to be getting the Vienna edit more than Courtney. Blakeley and Vienna kept their eyes on the prize, burning a bridge here or there, but nothing like Courtney. Vienna, to me at least, voiced her opinion in a very blunt, unapologetic way, not realizing that she needed some finesse. I don't believe she intentionally wanted to hurt anyone. Courtney, on the other hand, digs at these girls. It's alarming in that she masterfully manipulates a situation. One second she invites no drama from the girls, and at the next moment, she's provoking them with snide, aggressive comments. Courtney appears to prefer the company of men who are easily subsumed by her spell. Courtney actually reminds me very much of Ali x 1 million. Scratch that-Courtney reminds me of Bentley, except she does seem to like Ben.

As for this season, is it as simple as it appears?

ETA: About the producers, it's always interesting to me that these producers lead the Bachelor or the Bach'ette towards one person over another. Cassie Lambert, the producer in charge of the lead, basically picked Roberto and JP for Ali and Ashley, respectively. At the end of last season, Ash tweeted that Cassie wrote down a name on night one of whom she thought was best for Ashley, telling Ash to open it after the FRC. It was JP. Maybe the producers don't influence their choice as much as we think, but for those leads that the show really seems to like, I can't imagine that they'd let them walk into trouble. As for Jake and Vienna, I'm pretty sure they let that one happen mostly for Jake's "burgeoning" acting career. If he picked the girl who caused the most sensation and provided the most tabloid fodder, his name would be everywhere. No idea what they're doing here with Ben.

[bamafan]

I'm not convinced that Courtney is the F1 - almost too obvious. I think TPTB want viewers to think that because it keeps people watching (kind of like a trainwreck). In some seasons, TPTB have kept the F1 hidden until week 3 or 4. Is it possible that Ben has strong feelings for someone we haven't seen much of yet - afterall, we only see a smidgen of what actually goes on. there are a few girls who we haven't seen much of who seem interesting - i'm thinking of Jaimie (not sure that's her name) and Nicki. I really don't get the feeling that Ben is looking for a wife. Think he's really just looking for a girlfriend. He seems like a nice guy, but there are definitely times when his immaturity and self-centeredness shows. I also get the feeling that several of the girls aren't really interested in Ben - just staying along for the ride.

[Midol]

As Midol noted, such a good point! I remember Blondie reminding us of this tidbit back during Aliberto's season.

At this point, Blakeley seems to be getting the Vienna edit more than Courtney. Blakeley and Vienna kept their eyes on the prize, burning a bridge here or there, but nothing like Courtney. Vienna, to me at least, voiced her opinion in a very blunt, unapologetic way, not realizing that she needed some finesse. I don't believe she intentionally wanted to hurt anyone. Courtney, on the other hand, digs at these girls. It's alarming in that she masterfully manipulates a situation. One second she invites no drama from the girls, and at the next moment, she's provoking them with snide, aggressive comments. Courtney appears to prefer the company of men who are easily subsumed by her spell. Courtney actually reminds me very much of Ali x 1 million. Scratch that-Courtney reminds me of Bentley, except she does seem to like Ben.

As for this season, is it as simple as it appears?

ETA: About the producers, it's always interesting to me that these producers lead the Bachelor or the Bach'ette towards one person over another. Cassie Lambert, the producer in charge of the lead, basically picked Roberto and JP for Ali and Ashley, respectively. At the end of last season, Ash tweeted that Cassie wrote down a name on night one of whom she thought was best for Ashley, telling Ash to open it after the FRC. It was JP. Maybe the producers don't influence their choice as much as we think, but for those leads that the show really seems to like, I can't imagine that they'd let them walk into trouble. As for Jake and Vienna, I'm pretty sure they let that one happen mostly for Jake's "burgeoning" acting career. If he picked the girl who caused the most sensation and provided the most tabloid fodder, his name would be everywhere. No idea what they're doing here with Ben.

Intersting you mentioned the resemblance between the Courtney/Blakeley/Vienna edits because I was thinking the exact same thing.

While I was certainly no fan of Vienna's...I was even less a fan of Jake's. I always thought that Vienna was young and immature and edited even worse because producers wanted to stick it to Fake Jake. While she was certainly old enough to know better, I gave her some slack because I know how these people get manipulated/edited and I remember myself at that age. Even though I was nothing like her, I do remember several episodes where my bluntness was not exactly appriciated and ended up hurting someones feelings. Hopefully age teaches her a few things...although not yet if we go by the BP2 from last summer. However, I never thought Vienna was truly mean...young, selfish, immature, self centered and for some strange reason attracted to Jake. As for Blakeley, she is older, but also used to using her sexuality to get what she wants like Vienna. She is focused on the prize (Ben...to each his own), but not truly mean and she just doesn't care what the other women think of her. Courtney is a much more dangerous opponent because she seems to be smarter, still has her eyes on the prize (the Neil Lane 2 carat ring) and is much more manipulative. She can also be in you face, but she also seems to be able to be subtle. A word here, a suggestion there, a subtle threat, she's got them down pat. She seems to be strategically using words to hurt and undermine the confidence of her opponents. She basically admitted that to the camera. Vienna was not that smart.

Also, with regard to producers steering contestants to one person over another, I do recall that being mentioned before, particularly if they liked you. I think I remember someone writing here during her season, that the producers were trying to steer Jill away from Ed but the heart wanted what the heart wanted. I've also wondered if sometimes, they try to steer the lead to someone because they think another person would be a better lead for the next season and they don't want that happening...Emily comes to mind during Brad's last go around.

[Longhornfan]

As Midol noted, such a good point! I remember Blondie reminding us of this tidbit back during Aliberto's season.

ETA: About the producers, it's always interesting to me that these producers lead the Bachelor or the Bach'ette towards one person over another. Cassie Lambert, the producer in charge of the lead, basically picked Roberto and JP for Ali and Ashley, respectively.

What tidbit did Blondie offer regarding Ali & Roberto? Was it that Ali seemed to be captivated by Roberto's looks - much like Ben is with Courtney the model? We even have the "Is this too good to be true" storyline with Ben wondering the same thing about Courtney that Ali expressed about Roberto. However, after that the comparison ends. Courtney is definitely being shown in an entirely different light than Roberto was.

[Midol]

What tidbit did Blondie offer regarding Ali & Roberto? Was it that Ali seemed to be captivated by Roberto's looks - much like Ben is with Courtney the model? We even have the "Is this too good to be true" storyline with Ben wondering the same thing about Courtney that Ali expressed about Roberto. However, after that the comparison ends. Courtney is definitely being shown in an entirely different light than Roberto was.

I always think they are worse when editing the women than the men. And if they don't like them, it's even worse. I think it is pretty much an accepted fact that everyone spoke highly of and liked Roberto...the other contestants and people who knew him. I don't think the same can be said of Courtney. From what I have read thus far, of the people that have known her, worked with her in the past, none have fond memories and generally agree that she is being edit as they remember her. Not the case with Roberto...didn't his co-workers nominate him?

[Fanny Mare]

Women are targets for other women. They do get the worst edits, I doubt if someone said Courtney was sweet, anyone would believe them.Most minds are made up from three episodes. Amazing