Courtney *No Spoilers*

[bachelorwatcher]

Isn't that a spoiler, too? I stayed out of this thread because I worried I'd read something like this, though it was so pervasive even in the recap threads that I kind-of knew anyway. If I really didn't want the ending spoiled, I would have had to stay away from any discussion of the show at all.

A poster saw a spoiler tthat they didn't want to see... and then they posted something about why would Ben want Courtney. I wasn't sure about who the final two would be, or if Ben's choice would accept his proposal, so I stopped reading all posts about the Bachelor show until the finale was over. That way, I made sure what happened on the finale would be a surprise for me. I stopped reading Chris Harrison's blog, and I never watched Jimmy Kimmel. During the finale, they showed Jimmy Kimmel holding up a picture of Courtney, so I looked away during the airing of the rest of the commercials and promos on the finale show. I thought Ben could have chosen Lindzi, and Kimmel was making fun of Courtney by holding up a picture of her.

[bee stung lips]

Isn't there someone for everyone? Ben's not exactly a candidate for Early Admissions at Harvard himself (yes, I know they don't do that any more).

I think the discussion of Courtney has become beyond ugly. To say that someone has a mental illness based on a few ITAs where we *know* the camera crew is egging her on is beyond ugly.

She very well could have had an immature reaction to the sorority hive mind Fleiss creates in these houses. This type of social experiment is going to bring out strange behavior in different people. And I think that's exactly what Fleiss is after here. These women are not treated well, and if they don't fit in with the sorority, it's a horrible experience.

Exactly. Couldn't agree more.

[Longhornfan]

Isn't there someone for everyone? Ben's not exactly a candidate for Early Admissions at Harvard himself (yes, I know they don't do that any more).

I think the discussion of Courtney has become beyond ugly. To say that someone has a mental illness based on a few ITAs where we *know* the camera crew is egging her on is beyond ugly.

She very well could have had an immature reaction to the sorority hive mind Fleiss creates in these houses. This type of social experiment is going to bring out strange behavior in different people. And I think that's exactly what Fleiss is after here. These women are not treated well, and if they don't fit in with the sorority, it's a horrible experience.

Okay, I understand that this situation is extremely unreal and no doubt can bring out the worst in people, but what is bothering me about this being used as an excuse and a way to give Courtney a pass on how she acted and spoke to and about the other women is this. That mean and nasty side of her has to really exist, whether it is her being defensive or just being sarcastic or sassy as she described herself. You can not tell me that Courtney does not know that those things hurt others, because I don't just don't buy that. Many things said with a sarcastic tone are MEANT to hurt. Courtney certainly can not be that dense and unable to read people's faces when handing out those jabs, can she? You can tell a lot by a person's body language as well.

Case in point, it is just not in my nature to say or do things that I know or even suspect will hurt others. There is no way that the producers would have ever been able to get me to say those means things, even strictly in the interviews away from the other women. I am not trying to say that I am perfect, but I will say that living in that sorority beehive (as you like to say) would not have changed my basic personality...period. Courtney said and did those things, so just let her claim them without trying to whitewash her intentions.

Ben has defended Courtney by saying that those mean things were circumstantial. That is another way of shifting the responsiblity off of Courtney and making it appear that the mean side of Courtney just isn't the real her. But it is a real part of her personality, just like the other nice side that Ben got to see is a part. So, even if the circumstances of living with a lot of women competing for the same man are meant to get all of those good soundbites and good footage, it is up to the individual as to how they act and respond when the producers are egging them on. Courtney has only herself to blame.

[bachelorwatcher]

The drama that Courtney created was boring. Courtney is annoying. Courtney skinny dipping and hugging Ben while naked after the skinny dipping is something that belongs on 'Bachelor Pad.'

[Anemic Dog]

But we don't know everything that went on in the house. It could well be very much like Lindzi's experience with her "call me" joke. Editing put it out of context. Which is not to say Courtney didn't say hurtful things, but perhaps she was telling the truth when she said she made an effort to be friendly, but just didn't fit in.

In an early season, we saw much the same thing, but Fleiss framed it more sympathetically to the outcast. More a Mean Girls type of scenario. A very attractive woman who clearly has the Bachelor's eye might be rebuffed if she tries to make friends.

As for the ITAs, sometimes these women don't know how they'll be portrayed - it's very unrealistic. When Rachel did her little smug thing with the rose after Blakeley was eliminated, that seemed very much like a camera crewperson was egging her on. "Hey, Rachel, Blakeley was sure making you feel like you had no chance today, and here you are while she's on her way home. How do you feel?" We see Rachel's reaction, but not the lead-up that produced the reaction.

This show is all about reactions, and very little about context.

[bee stung lips]

The drama that Courtney created was boring.

If it was so boring, then why are her fellow bachelorette's still bitter over it? Why were sneers plastered across the faces of even the women sitting in the audience (which made them look ridiculous, by the way) of the Women Tell All and After the Final Rose shows? People STILL can't get over Courtney and her alleged "horrible" behaviour. Boring doesn't generate this type of extreme reaction, but rather would have created no reaction at all. Whether one likes Courtney or not, to say that she or the drama she created was boring couldn't be any further from the truth.

[echo226]

But we don't know everything that went on in the house. It could well be very much like Lindzi's experience with her "call me" joke. Editing put it out of context. Which is not to say Courtney didn't say hurtful things, but perhaps she was telling the truth when she said she made an effort to be friendly, but just didn't fit in.

In an early season, we saw much the same thing, but Fleiss framed it more sympathetically to the outcast. More a Mean Girls type of scenario. A very attractive woman who clearly has the Bachelor's eye might be rebuffed if she tries to make friends.

As for the ITAs, sometimes these women don't know how they'll be portrayed - it's very unrealistic. When Rachel did her little smug thing with the rose after Blakeley was eliminated, that seemed very much like a camera crewperson was egging her on. "Hey, Rachel, Blakeley was sure making you feel like you had no chance today, and here you are while she's on her way home. How do you feel?" We see Rachel's reaction, but not the lead-up that produced the reaction.

This show is all about reactions, and very little about context.

But every woman knows about what you call this "sorority hive mentality" and the editing when they sign up for it.
They know they will have a role and I think many are even selected/cast with the desired storyline in mind.

One would expect that each woman has a "strategy" for coping going in and I believe Courtney and Lindzi both had that, albeit different. Both strategies were actually effective and I think both women had a plan for the end game, regardless of the outcome.

[Jexter]

The drama that Courtney created was boring. Courtney is annoying. Courtney skinny dipping and hugging Ben while naked after the skinny dipping is something that belongs on 'Bachelor Pad.'

I'm a Ben fan but he became boring very quickly this season and I only watched bits and pieces. I don't think he should have done the show. I think the whole Ashley thing hit him hard -whether or not it was ego or true love (I pick up on a little of both, but I think he really liked Ashley).

And, I think he's very particular and none of the girls this season did it for him. I don't think he is dumb. A dumb person doesn't get to the point of creating a successful winery. And a dumb person doesn't fall for a U of PA graduate student and vice-versa.

What I got from this season is that none of the girls in the bunch had the combination of intellect and general chemistry that did it for him.

Courtney was at least "fun". He said once that Courtney "got it", i.e. she understood how to operate on this show. None of the others did. And, I think he detested the tattle-telling.

I'm no Courtney fan....any girl who skinny dips on national television and/or hugs a guy while completely nude (I didn't see that episode ... this is what I understand happened though) - any guy - is lacking self-esteem and a certain amount of moral character. Still, I get why Ben picked her - esp. if none of the others were to his taste. He just picked the one whose company he enjoyed the most. No love was invovled as far as I can tell. I really don't have a problem with her behavior or his decision.

The one area I take issue with has to do with Ben's post-show dalliances. Out of respect for all involved, including himself, he should have waited until after the reunion to start babe-hounding. That was rather Courtney-like of him. I can only guess that after watching the show on TV, he realized Courtney wasn't going to be "it" for him.

Anyhoo...this season is best forgotten about. Kind of a waste of everyone's time.

[imissme]

From what I have been reading, the ratings for this season's "The Bachelor" have been below what they have been for other seasons. So, maybe, just maybe, MF will take heed and return the show to it's original premise. Which I thought was...finding true love. Not finding the trash. I dare to hope.

[Fanny Mare]

Anyhoo...this season is best forgotten about. Kind of a waste of every one's time.

I think a lot of people agree with you. I have spoken to a few people about this show( this year and last) online and in RL. For the most part they have said it's been a time waster. Thank goodness we have a choice, nobody makes us watch it. I wish somewhere TPTB could see what they are turning this show into. I do not think it will change, because ratings high or low, doesn't seem to matter to them. They have a formula, and they keep thinking its working I am sure on that cutting room floor they have really nice footage of all the contestants on this show .Nice doesn't seem to work does it? Emily's show in May will still have the most ___ ever. There will be a guy that needs to tell her about another guy, who is there for all the wrong reasons. I think I could write the dang thing! LOL

As an aside, it interesting to hear Chris say she is playing the game .Or, she just isn't good at the game. It just goes to show what this is really all about, its a game.Nothing more, nothing less.