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Thread: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

  1. #21
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    Well I think that Whitney winning wouldn't really make a difference. Hardly anyone takes America's Next Top Model seriously because no winner has ever went on to great success in the fashion industry. The show doesn't even focus any attention on physical fitness. Australia's Next Top Model emphasizes the notion that the girls need to be a certain size and be physically fit in order to get runway work because no designer would want to hire a model who has "bad" (I use that word loosley) proportions. I remember Saleisha used to have the unmodelesque proportions of 32(?)-26.5-37.5. Most models have proportions like 32-23-34 or 33-24-34. As ridiculous as the latter measurements may sound, those are the measurements that get work. So in terms of working on the runway or in the fashion industry in general, yes, Saleisha along with many other contestants on the show America's Next Top Model needed to "check [their] thighs in the mirror." I think this "choosing a winner to represent the average American woman" is just another stupid thing that Tyra did to make herself seem like a saint. What should really matter is how good of a model the contestant is as opposed to their missions or their messages or their personalities or the portion of the American population that the contestants represent. In the fashion industry... hardly any of that matters.
    I'm not necessarily saying that skinny itself is perfect, but skinny is what's generally considered perfect in the fashion industry. Crystal Renn is widely known as one of the more successful plus size models, but what has she done throughout the past year? Her nymag model profile has nothing listed for the past year and she never landed the cover of a Vogue whereas the marginally thinner Sophie Dahl (who was also considered a plus size model at one point) has gotten three British Vogue covers and an Italian Vogue cover. So no matter how much we try to convince ourselves otherwise, plus size models are just not going to be successful in the mainstream market right now no matter what kind of message Whitney's win is conveying.

  2. #22
    Premium Member Lucy4588's Avatar
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by duckiies;3010841;
    In regards to the "Whitney is fat" comments I've seen all over the web:

    Whitney's body mass index is 22.8. The healthy range for BMI 18.5-24.9. So it boggles my mind when Whitney is accused of being "fat." Whitney is a healthy American woman. Not too small, not too big. Just normal & healthy. Weight shouldn't matter as long as a person is healthy and okay with their body image.
    And even BMI isn't always a good assessment of weight because it doesn't take body fat vs. muscle mass into account. A lot of the time people who look to be of a normal healthy size that have a lot of muscles can technically be "obese" based on BMI since only height and weight are taken into account.
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  3. #23
    FORT Fanatic infinite's Avatar
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by duckiies;3010841;
    Whitney's body mass index is 22.8
    i didn't know information regarding her accurate height and weight were released.

    "Skinny is perfect" is basically the motto for anorexia nervosa
    i completely disagree with that.
    i'm not saying anything not skinny is imperfect,
    but i think being thin gives you the most potential to
    become a model. and i definitely do not suffer from
    anorexia, so i don't think that's a fixed motto for all
    people who are victims of that eating disorder at all.
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  4. #24
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by infinite;3011038;
    i didn't know information regarding her accurate height and weight were released.



    i completely disagree with that.
    i'm not saying anything not skinny is imperfect,
    but i think being thin gives you the most potential to
    become a model. and i definitely do not suffer from
    anorexia, so i don't think that's a fixed motto for all
    people who are victims of that eating disorder at all.

    everything about that "motto" screams anorexia.... besides control anorexia revolves around "perfection" with the mindset that skinny is perfect
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  5. #25
    FORT Fogey bucwild's Avatar
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    I don't have a problem with the fashion industry their standards but I have a problem with them not acknowledging those standards sometimes have negative effects on young girls/women such as anorexia nervosa ( not anorexia because their is a difference between the two. I know they don't hold the girls finger and control their eating habits but I don't see how they can deny that eating disorders exist in the fashion industry. It reminds me of how Major League Baseball turned a blind eye towards steroids until the scandals broke out.

    Recently one of the industry's hottest new talents Ali Michael confessed she suffered from anorexia nervosa and it was rumored that Karlie Kloss suffers from it to (she denies it). If more models speak out and confess to have these eating disorders maybe something can be done about it. I know it will probably kill their chances in the industry by being a whistleblower but in the long run it would be worth it.
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  6. #26
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    One thing that someone brought up in discussion of project runway was designers choosing thin models. I think it has a lot of relevance in this discussion. Why do designers prefer thin models to large models? The answer: It is way easier to design in 2-dimensions than three dimensions. Thin models are the closest a designer can get to 2-D! So the thinner, the better. Creating a sexy dress, but the models don't have breasts? Stuff it or make the design enhance the chest. It is so much easier to create breasts when they do not exist than to hide them when they do. Thinner models are used because it is easier to make dresses translate from paper to a model if that model is as close to the paper as possible (and that means that they must be 2-D).
    So then any designer can design in 2-D. Shouldn't a good designer be able to work in 3-dimensions? Yes, they should be able to! If a designer has to use thin models, it shows that he/she has limitations. 2-D is not the real world! A good designer should be able to design clothes that can actually be worn in the real world. Instead, the fashion industry tries to make real people strive for unreal standards of body size. Those tricky designers with limited skills have fooled us. They have managed to hide their own shortcomings by convincing us that we are the ones who are coming up short (or too fat, whichever). My point is, that a good designer does not need to use super thin models because he/she will know how to design for any and every body type there is.

  7. #27
    FORT Fogey bucwild's Avatar
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    They have managed to hide their own shortcomings by convincing us that we are the ones who are coming up short (or too fat, whichever). My point is, that a good designer does not need to use super thin models because he/she will know how to design for any and every body type there is.
    But if you call them out on it, they will cry blooded murder. Then call criticized everybody else that don't fit their standards but the minute you even QUESTION their's it's a sin, they're shock, etc. I know Whitney isn't the first to do it but she's sort of the first one to do it on Top Model and it's creating a huge debate in the threads.
    Last edited by bucwild; 05-20-2008 at 07:25 PM.
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  8. #28
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    - true that! We've been conned by those designers!!!!

  9. #29
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Iynereh;3009980;
    Just be eat healthy and stay fit, and if you are thin or big, as long as you are healthy it does not matter...
    I agree, but I still think it's healthier to be 20 pounds overweight than to be 20 pounds underweight.
    You have no energy, and get sick easy.. etc.

  10. #30
    26.2, baby! Allie's Avatar
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    Re: ANTM Weight and Body Issues Thread

    Interesting discussion. I know I boycott stretch denim jeans because I think it is just the industry's way to hide poor design. Lazy. Give me a good cut.

    I can only speak from personal experience. I've probably covered most of the weight extremes in my life. My lowest was about 66 pounds in my mid-teens (I'm very short). My highest was about, oh 146-150 after I had my son. Between the span of about 25 years or so I've been between sizes 00 to 10.

    I was one of those girls who cut out pictures of models in Seventeen Magazine and pasted them up in the back of my closet. Yes, I had Anorexia Nervosa. I also had bulimia for 10 years (you don't always have both or have them at the same time).

    I was taunted as a child for being fat and later was criticized for being super skinny. THe later I just brushed off as people being jealous. The first? It just hurt and some people went out of their way to be as cruel as possible. Most of the skinny comments came from people who were concerned about my health. But there were some people being mean when I was skinny, too. Sometimes people are just jerks and will use whatever ammunition they can to hurt you.

    The modeling industry swings in what it finds "hot" for model shapes. Always thin, but athletic and sexy have been in. I hate the heroin chic look. There are some models I get literally sick looking at because they remind me so much of myself as a teen. It's the look in their eyes. Models like Jaslene or Fatima just look naturally thin to me. They wear clothes well and I have no problem enjoying their work. I know that not all models have eating disorders or are too thin for their health. But some do and are. It is the general perception out in the public, I believe. I know some people believe that that is what is needed to be a "super model" or "top model." (I hate those phrases. Used too much. Modeling has changed a lot over the last couple of decades)

    And skinny is perfect IS a mantra that I used. I thought I could never be too skinny. I actually had people ask if I was a model. I laughed and said, too short. But I took it as validation that the others who said I was too thin were wrong. They were jealous. Mind you, I almost ended up in the hospital.

    Just because the industry uses really thin girls because they've always used thin girls and they can't change because that is the way the industry has always been is just BS. That argument does not hold up in any business. Just because you've always done it that way does not mean it is the best and only way to do it. It is not going to happen overnight, but that's not the point. Small steps are better than nothing. And I do believe their is room for different sized models. Different designers do different styles that look good on different bodies.

    I just roll my eyes at the vague all-encompassing statements by Whitney that are picked up in articles and TV spots. Those get quoted. But they sometimes get in the way of the message (healthy is beautiful) and cause hard feelings and defensiveness from those who either have been thin all their life (and are very healthy) and those who like the really skinny models and feel personally attacked. But would people listed otherwise? Sexy gets the publicity in the entertainment industry. I know some would listen. But would enough?.

    In the end fashion is a business. There is a bottom line. If that bottom line is affected too much, then change will happen.

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