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Thread: Kim Locke and Clay Aiken... Are they the most talented?

  1. #71
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    Originally posted by BeenAikened
    Anyway, I'd like to ask Rosa a particular question about negotiating one's passagios and forward placement. I've been training with a vocal teacher for 2 yrs and his emphasis has been on negotiating my breaks to achieve one smooth column from chest, middle, head and vice versa. This has been most difficult to achieve and perfect for me. How can somebody with little professional training like Clay seems to have no "break" problem at all? Is this due to his natural speaking voice, being a Southerner who naturally has a bit of nasal quality in his voice and speaks in forward placement? Thanks very much in advance.

    Good question! One, I suspect he has had more training than officially stated--possibly some advice he's picked up from various sources on his musical journey. He is a very intelligent singer and he listens and learns. I also suspect this because I am catching little things he does with his body language while he is singing that telegraphs to me "Voice Coach".... However, I do want to point out that the coaching he is receiving on the show helps to clean up and point out certain things about his performance for the week and does not replace a voice teacher who builds a voice from top to bottom.

    His natural speaking voice is set forward and does naturally enable him to sing in the correct position. How does that explain his smooth traversing through the passagio? It doesn't. He has worked it through probably from practice, practice, practice. You know, I have a voice student who just couldn't get it--I would try so many visual exercises to get him to properly negotiate this area of his singing. He was starting to become such a lazy singer. For motivation, I even promised him a solo when our chorus played Carnegie Hall if he would just practice this one area with his voice. Finally, I told him the story of how Pavarotti would just practice his vowels over and over every day up and down fifth scales, opening and closing his throat through the passagio until it became a muscle memory. It's like a ballet dancer performing plies every morning at the barre. Same simple exercises.

    He finally managed to feel what his voice was doing and now he can manage the breaks without too much difficulty. He's studying to be an operatic tenor at a first rate university.


    Okay...for anyone who reads this that has sent me private e-mails. I will try to respond when and if I can. I just need to get some sleep. Have a good night.
    Last edited by Rosa; 05-05-2003 at 12:08 AM.

  2. #72
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    [QUOTE]Originally posted by Rosa
    [B]
    Originally posted by John
    one has the great technique, intelligence and musicality
    thats all you need

  3. #73
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    Rosa,
    Thank you so much for taking the time to share your expertise!

  4. #74
    FORT Fogey kyrjar's Avatar
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    Posted by Thumper
    Clay and Kim have superior singing voices. Kim's is the most trained of the three, Clay is first runner-up on the training, but a more pure 'natural' voice than Kim. Ruben does not have as much mastery of his vocal instrument, but that can be learned

    ****************************** **********

    I think Rosa cleared this up quite well. Her analysis was that Ruben had training and Clay and Kim L not so much.

    Based on Fox's bios, Ruben has actually had far more training than anyone (he majored in voice at college). I was surprised by this, because I thought Kim L was teaching a masters class in voice (didn't Randy say that once) and yet she and Clay have had very little training. Kim and Clay both have natural voices. This is also why Kim and Clay have grown the most during the competition whereas Ruben has not (the judges certainly have not helped in that regard by not pushing him to improve).

    Rosa, loved your analysis. I don't think it takes away from enjoying the performances at all. It puts the non-trained feelings into perspective. But, in the end, I will still probably like what I like.

    I would love to hear what you think of Josh, Trenyce, Julia, Kim L, Carmen and the others (in that order).

  5. #75
    Melissa M = BARF Threshold's Avatar
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    Originally posted by TheFlying
    Absolutely noone would be saying that had Simon not brought it up. Noone. Noone was saying it before he did, and they wouldn't had he not.
    That is not true.

    The week he sang Somewhere Out There, my mother was in town to visit us and our baby. All three of us that night commented on how he would be absolutely amazing on Broadway.

    The problem is, that is not an insult.

    To quote the song "New York, New York", regarding Broadway:
    "If you can make it there, you can make it anywhere."

    Broadway quality singers are a million times more talented than any stupid, fabricated "American Idol."

    Too many people are interpreting the Broadway comment as a slam.
    -Michael

    Threshold RPG - Our World, Your Imagination

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  6. #76
    On My Way Here Grisabella's Avatar
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    Threshold
    ...All three of us that night commented on how [Clay] would be absolutely amazing on Broadway.&nbsp...&nbsp

    Too many people are interpreting the Broadway comment as a slam.
    That's because too many people are SAYING it as a slam, Threshold. Clay's detractors use it as a rationale for his somehow not having what it takes to make it in the "pop" world.
    I don't quite get their logic, but it's clear that a lot of those saying it -- including Simon -- have meant it as a slam "within the context of this [AI] competition."

  7. #77
    FORT Regular katerina's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Threshold
    Broadway quality singers are a million times more talented than any stupid, fabricated "American Idol."

    Too many people are interpreting the Broadway comment as a slam.
    THANK YOU. I've been trying to tell anyone who tells me he's "too broadway" that it is NOT an insult.

    You don't have a recording studio to fix what you screw up when you're on Broadway. When you're on Broadway it's all you and JUST you, so you gotta be damn near perfect.

  8. #78
    Melissa M = BARF Threshold's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Grisabella
    Threshold

    That's because too many people are SAYING it as a slam, Threshold. Clay's detractors use it as a rationale for his somehow not having what it takes to make it in the "pop" world.
    I don't quite get their logic, but it's clear that a lot of those saying it -- including Simon -- have meant it as a slam "within the context of this [AI] competition."
    Let them say it as a slam.

    They are just demonstrating their ignorance by saying it.

    "Yeah, that Jerry Rice isn't such a good wide receiver. He catches too many touchdowns."

    -Michael

    Threshold RPG - Our World, Your Imagination

    http://www.thresholdrpg.com

  9. #79
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    Rosa, thanks for the in-depth explanations.

  10. #80
    Yoffy lifts a finger... fluff's Avatar
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    I don't think many people are saying it as a slam.
    It's just an observation based on his enunciation and somewhat "theatrical presentation". (in their opinion)
    I think Clay is very "Broadway", Simon clearly does too.

    I don't think he's too Broadway, just very Broadway.
    He has a background in amateur musical theatre so I imagine he would be thrilled to have the opportunity to work in that genre.

    Slam or no slam he's going to win the show.
    If all Clay fans have to complain about from this board is people making Broadway references they should consider themselves lucky.
    Try being a Ruben fan reading through the "first thing that comes to mind" thread and seeing comments like "eh, overhyped, fad".
    Imagine being Ruben and reading that.
    If I were a contestant, I'd rather read I was "Broadway" than I was "over-hyped"
    "That's Numberwang!"

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