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Thread: Who Do You Think Shocked Fox/19E The Most?

  1. #21
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    Shockers- Canyon not getting in, Taylor making it before Tori, and Chantel not raising the bar.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1083
    I think that 19 is probably incredibly surprised (and not particularly happy) that AJ has been so lackluster, I am sure that they started pulling their hair out the moment no guys made it through the second semis as that risked exactly what they might be headed for, 4 girls and 1 guy and that's just not something they can market at all (nor did they want 4 guys and 1 girl) and were counting on AJ as a shoo-in then praying for Chauncey (its been obvious from week one that Morgan had zero chance) to get in to give them two guys- they may still get that but I doubt it. I think that Katelyn will actually pick up a goodly number of votes from people who voted for Lucy this week and it's clear Chantel has a big following so he may not even finish second let alone first.

    Second, I think that they were really pulling for Danielle, she's really the only singer in her niche, a sweet voiced mellow toned audience pleasing singer. The songs they gave her in the Semis and the first two weeks were absolutely tailor made for her, and when that didn't work they have tried twice now to dress her up and have her move around like a Thompson Sister with no postive results whatsoever. At this point think her chances of making it are all but extinguished.

    I find the whines and moans that they have fixed things to be comical, no one with the least sense of marketing would have chosen the four kids who have made it through as the first four in (not that 19 has shown any knowledge of how to maket the AJ product but that's a different paragraph).
    I think the producers are going to bury the American Juniors about 10 minutes after the last show cuz there's liittle or nothing else they can do at this point. There will be an album that will be greeted by sheer apathy and poof it will all be gone.

    I am sure if you eavesdropped on their production planning they would have more or less planned for this group (its a pretty prototypical vocal group)

    1. POWER SINGER (CHANTEL, LUCY, KATELYN which also takes care of having a "hot chick" in the group)
    2. MALE HEARTTHROB (AJ,CANYON maybe QUENTIN)
    3. SWEET AND MELLOW ( DANIELLE, maybe LAUREN, sort of but not really CHAUNCEY)
    4. VERYYYYYY ENERGETIC (TORI,TAYLOR,JORDAN,MERCEDES,T YLER, MORGAN)
    5. VERY ENERGETIC PART 2/POWER SINGER PART2 (choose one)

    As you can see its not gone real well for them

    I also think AJ got so far off-track because its obvious Simon has had little or no real involvement, no matter what you think of him on-camera he has been the creative soul behind AI. He didn't sign his contract extension with FOX until AK was wellllll under way and was clearly spending that time period on the ill fated Cupid. It appears AJ was a patchwork thrown together affair
    that never really had a central figure mapping it out. The dancing, wardrobe, song choices, show format (particularly the ZERO behind the scenes footage), camera work, cheesy videos, random song years and virtual avoidance of any real interactions with the singers themselves all scream out that no one who really had a clue what made AI popular was in charge. To be quite honest, given that AJ got the ratings it did when it was mismanaged at such an incredible level, chances are that somone who had the first clue of how to maket a kids based product could probaly get a 10 rating or better on a weekly basis.

    I agree with almost everything in your post. But I don't know where you got the idea that Simon Cowell was the creative soul behind AI. Simon Fuller is the man who created AI and everything I've read from interviews with the contestants to first-hand reports of audience members points to Nigel Lithgoe being the "big man" behind the scenes.

    Have you noticed that all it would take for this group to match your description of what they should have planned for is for AJ to be voted in?
    And I think he has an excellent chance. Chantel is very popular, but she's been passed over several times already and it could happen again.

    It wouldn't surprise me if 19E doesn't even bother to do a CD. I can't see that they could justify spending money on it, unless they come up with some sort of publicity campaign to build up the fanbase they failed to create with AJ.

  3. #23
    FORT Fan yahright's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zippy
    It wouldn't surprise me if 19E doesn't even bother to do a CD. I can't see that they could justify spending money on it, unless they come up with some sort of publicity campaign to build up the fanbase they failed to create with AJ.
    I think that's exactly what they'll do, a publicity campaign. And that will be the key to their success, if they have any.

  4. #24
    I think I have a clue 1083's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zippy
    I agree with almost everything in your post. But I don't know where you got the idea that Simon Cowell was the creative soul behind AI. Simon Fuller is the man who created AI and everything I've read from interviews with the contestants to first-hand reports of audience members points to Nigel Lithgoe being the "big man" behind the scenes.

    Have you noticed that all it would take for this group to match your description of what they should have planned for is for AJ to be voted in?
    And I think he has an excellent chance. Chantel is very popular, but she's been passed over several times already and it could happen again.

    It wouldn't surprise me if 19E doesn't even bother to do a CD. I can't see that they could justify spending money on it, unless they come up with some sort of publicity campaign to build up the fanbase they failed to create with AJ.
    I agree that Lithgoe has MUCH to do with AI's success but I still think not so simple Simon was the firebrand for the show and it it was his original vision that was faithfully translated into reality. If there was a vision for AJ it badly needs glasses.

    I don't really agreee that my list was close to being obtained in that wasn't really clearly enough articulated I suppose. They PLANNED on a spot for Tori as a spunky pre-teen but the "fifth" spot ideally would have gone to a second power singer (in this case Chantel after Lucy went in) and failing that to an "older" contestant with both a fairly strong voice and mucho stage presence. Morgan would have been perfect except for the small flaw the audience loathes him. It's pretty obvious that someone out there tried to jam Danielle into this spot not once but twice and, as the St Pete Times article suggests, she wasn't real happy with the non-results. I don't really have that much clear recall of the Semis but I think Grace and the painfully overlooked Kristina would have fit here well. Taylor's presence simply duplicates her sister, particularly since neither has anything like a strong voice denying the group a crowd pleaser who can carry some harmonies- notice both T sisters are basically buried in all the group numbers. The group has a massive hole in it because Chauncey really doesn't fit in the sweet, mellow slot (if you ever listened to the Go-Gos, Bangles or Klymaxx you will know what I mean), among other things his voice warbles at times rather than establishes a smooth pitch perfect melody and it may well change soon and Danielle truly seems like the only one remotely close to this type of singer. 4 girls is a death blow to the group so that means they need another guy (they must have literally rolled on the floor moaning when they realized Quentin, Canyon AND Brandan (?) all bombed out) but math says you can't get AJ,Chantel and Danielle all in when there's one spot left. Two out of three would have been fine because Chauncey is a wildcard with real talent and the added bonus of being both male and African-American (two demographics desperately needed). When they got The T sisters 1 and 2 the group instantly became too young for what they were obviously planning (read a slightly younger version of S groups) and after Chauncey got in they still SORELY lacked anything like the power voices needed to carry the songs. Game over basically before it even began and the sad/bad ratings meant that the group was pretty much doomed to be stillborn before AJs was ever fully formed.

    On the subject of the CD I am still betting there is one because studio time typically needs to be booked well in advance and usually requires hefty down payments (though 19 may have their own facility?) and the contracts almost certainly guarentee one anyway. Even if they sell just 100,00 they will make a little bit of money on it so why not.

    One final thing: was I the only one shocked that AJs couldn't advance at least one African-American power/soul type female singer? I just think there had to be ONE out there. A truly painful oversight from the beginning. No matter what evil slimy things you think of Gladys Knight as a judge if you ever heard her sing in her prime you know a voice like hers not only can carry the group it can BEEEEEE the group. I just don't get it.
    everybody has the right to speak their mind, so don't shoot me if I speak mine- ray davies

  5. #25
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    The Group Format is Where They Went Wrong

    Where they went wrong was by making this show a group format. What was the possibility that out of 20 kids, the public would vote 5 kids that meshed well together?

    It should've been a contest to find ONE junior idol with elimination rounds. They could've started with 32 then go down to 16, 8, 4, 2, 1. And if any of the non-winners were good enough to go solo or form a group, 19E could do it at their own will.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1083
    One final thing: was I the only one shocked that AJs couldn't advance at least one African-American power/soul type female singer? I just think there had to be ONE out there. A truly painful oversight from the beginning. No matter what evil slimy things you think of Gladys Knight as a judge if you ever heard her sing in her prime you know a voice like hers not only can carry the group it can BEEEEEE the group. I just don't get it.
    Good point! When I ever think of teen idols, this is the type of performer I think of...and there's never seemed to be a shortage of young black female soul singers. You'd think that out of thousands of kids, they'd be able to find one Monica, Mya, or Aaliyah. Maybe those type of singers were put off by the prospect of having to sing chessy pop tunes.

  7. #27
    I think I have a clue 1083's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheTruth
    Where they went wrong was by making this show a group format. What was the possibility that out of 20 kids, the public would vote 5 kids that meshed well together?

    It should've been a contest to find ONE junior idol with elimination rounds. They could've started with 32 then go down to 16, 8, 4, 2, 1. And if any of the non-winners were good enough to go solo or form a group, 19E could do it at their own will.

    True, true, true. I think two things stood in the way of the obvious way to go. One is they chickened out thinking elimination would sour viewers and hurt the ratings (they were so proud of themselves for thinking that out they spontaneously made ten decisions to completely plunder any chance of ratings :rolleyes) and simple greed. They thought the band (why band and not group, I never got that) would be HUGE and were already getting off-shore bank accounts ready for all their bounty - alas mismanagement equals nothing to manage in the corporate world and showbiz too.
    everybody has the right to speak their mind, so don't shoot me if I speak mine- ray davies

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1083
    They thought the band (why band and not group, I never got that) would be HUGE and were already getting off-shore bank accounts ready for all their bounty - alas mismanagement equals nothing to manage in the corporate world and showbiz too.
    LOL...well 19E still comes out as the winners in this process- despite the low ratings, they probably still get decent demographics, thus good advertising money out of this. Plus that promotional tie-in with Burger King doesn't hurt.

    With the likely millions that 19E has made from this show, the least they could do is give these kids a CD with decent distribution and promotion.

  9. #29
    FORT Fan yahright's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheTruth
    Good point! When I ever think of teen idols, this is the type of performer I think of...and there's never seemed to be a shortage of young black female soul singers. You'd think that out of thousands of kids, they'd be able to find one Monica, Mya, or Aaliyah. Maybe those type of singers were put off by the prospect of having to sing chessy pop tunes.
    The reason why they probably didn't find one was because of "perception." When you look at tv, what do you mostly see? Someone white. How many pretty black girls do you see in movies compared to pretty white girls. It's like a 100 to 1 ratio if you look at the overall scene, the numbers could be even more, I'm just estimating. And if you look in this competition, ofcourse they are picking based on looks, too. I doubt Jordan, Danielle, and the Thompson sisters had the best voices out of the thousands who entered, but they're looks was such a determining factor, that they actually beat maybe hundreds of singers better than them, and that most likely included many black girls.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by yahright
    When you look at tv, what do you mostly see? Someone white. How many pretty black girls do you see in movies compared to pretty white girls. It's like a 100 to 1 ratio if you look at the overall scene, the numbers could be even more, I'm just estimating.
    Sorry, but gotta disagree with you there...we aren't in the '60s anymore.

    Look at all the TV shows with cute black kids on them- My Wife and Kids, Bernie Mac, whatever they show on the WB channel.

    Have you watched BET or MTV lately? Look at all the teen idols- Monica, Mya, Brandy, Solange, Ashanti, etc.

    These kids probably have more opportunities than kids like the Thompsons given the current landscape. My theory is that there's plenty of them out there, but they figured they'd find better opportunities than a cheesy reality show/pop group.

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