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Thread: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

  1. #71
    FORT Fan marthakent's Avatar
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by jadewarlock View Post
    It is unfortunately a part of our history, so I had no problem with it as I haven't with them having a stop at Hiroshima, Auschwitz, and a few other places. And - given that everyone seemed to be bouncing with joy to the tune of how positive Socialism is - not knowing what was being said, it was needed so maybe the contestants - and us - learn about other cultures.

    I was surprised they even had a leg in Vietnam myself because of the political arguments - even now - between hawks and doves during that era.
    I agree whole heartedly that this felt inappropriate. If they hadn't captioned the Socialism song, that would have helped. The B-52 is an unfortunate part of history and, while in poor taste as a pitstop, might not have seemed so offensive after the song lyrics. Bad call, CBS!
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  2. #72
    FORT Fogey redsox girl's Avatar
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by Orion Nebula View Post
    I'm so sorry to hear that. When I was watching I wondered how many people that brought up bad memories for.

    I cringed over the wreckage of the B52.
    Other veterans (and their families) see things differently, despite having their own terrible experiences. They definitely don't view this as propaganda. That's why political statements are touchy things. For every opinion stated there are opposing opinions of equal weight and value and passion that are not expressed. Hopefully we can move on from this and enjoy The Amazing Race and the citizens they meet along the way, no matter where they are.We have such a short history but that history involves negative and positive experiences with so many countries. I hope The Amazing race doesn't edit where they go because to me part of the shows value, it's biggest value is in the the encounters between the contestants and the human beings they meet and the cultures they are a part of however briefly, in all parts of the world.The songs ansd music featured on the show are not socialist or government sponsored. The show isn't mocking veterans or being disrespectful. It's no different than shwing a bunch of Germans singing German folk songs in a beer Garden. It is how they sound, they are not mocking WWII veterans.
    Last edited by redsox girl; 03-18-2013 at 07:54 PM.
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  3. #73
    Fly it proudly FlyAKite's Avatar
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    This is the first time that I am not rooting for anyone to win. Everyone is just so-so and for me no one really stands out. I think I just enjoy the scenery more because I am not focused on how my favorite players are doing in a task.

    I fell for the father and son and I could tell how much they loved and respected each other. I think that bond is very special and they set a great example for what in life is truly important.
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  4. #74
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by FlyAKite View Post
    This is the first time that I am not rooting for anyone to win. Everyone is just so-so and for me no one really stands out. I think I just enjoy the scenery more because I am not focused on how my favorite players are doing in a task.

    I fell for the father and son and I could tell how much they loved and respected each other. I think that bond is very special and they set a great example for what in life is truly important.
    I feel pretty much the same, I feel that way about survivor as well
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  5. #75
    CCL
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    But they've been to Vietnam before (seasons 3, 10 and 15)....I don't see why Vietnam would require the show now to air "propaganda" when they didn't before. I don't think the leg was set up to offend -or propagandize -anyone. If they limited countries visited to only those with positive historical relationships with the US it would limit the show so much, I think.
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  6. #76
    FORT Fogey jadewarlock's Avatar
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    CCL - my point is there have been many locations where they have been which are Communist/Socialist/other rules than republic. And there are plenty of histories in each of them that don't need to rely on a previous war nor their politics.

    And in two of the cases I recall - Hiroshima and Auschwitz - they did a REFLECTION of what happened there. Out of those two - Hiroshima was US attacking Japan with a nuclear bomb which killed many people. It ended the war but at a great cost of life of all kinds. Auschwitz too was Germany attacking its own people simply because they weren't Aryan. And there are some who blame US for the amount of deaths in those concentration/extermination camps because we ignored the few who managed to escape and give us the information.

    But they still stayed and remembered and learned. Here - they just went to the stop, decided if they wanted to U-Turn people and were told to go to a pit stop. They didn't pause and reflect there - so it was almost an insult to injury so to speak.

    Vietnam - like the Korean conflict and the wars after Vietnam - are to this day very controversial and the effects from ending those wars are still felt today. With SO MANY things that people can focus on that are not political anywhere, I can see why people are a bit offended here and wonder if in this particular case - ESPECIALLY now that I know about the teams visiting Hanoi Hilton, Vietnam demanded a balance to the "old South Vietnam propaganda" when the US showed the POW camp.

  7. #77
    FORT Fogey jadewarlock's Avatar
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by redsox girl View Post
    .The songs ansd music featured on the show are not socialist or government sponsored. The show isn't mocking veterans or being disrespectful. It's no different than shwing a bunch of Germans singing German folk songs in a beer Garden. It is how they sound, they are not mocking WWII veterans.
    Sorry - in this case, the song WAS a pro-Socialist song. Not only did they have the Communist symbols (and a few Socialist symbols - they had a few stars mixed in with the Hammer and Sickle) the subtitles said what the song said. One line was roughly "Socialism is a good thing, brightens our day" and "Our children are stronger thanks to our government."

    I do see your point, but I can see how the song and stage show with obvious symbols will bother some veterans. Even my father would have said something if he were still with us: he was in ROTC in college, and had a high enough number that he could've easily been called into the draft. That said - even just being in ROTC, NEVER going overseas, could get you called a "baby killer."

    I will say this much - this topic on the episode has had people talk. Maybe it was a good thing because it's making people look at our past - which given our current lives, we need to see.
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  8. #78
    FORT Fogey redsox girl's Avatar
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    Quote Originally Posted by jadewarlock View Post
    Sorry - in this case, the song WAS a pro-Socialist song. Not only did they have the Communist symbols (and a few Socialist symbols - they had a few stars mixed in with the Hammer and Sickle) the subtitles said what the song said. One line was roughly "Socialism is a good thing, brightens our day" and "Our children are stronger thanks to our government."

    I do see your point, but I can see how the song and stage show with obvious symbols will bother some veterans. Even my father would have said something if he were still with us: he was in ROTC in college, and had a high enough number that he could've easily been called into the draft. That said - even just being in ROTC, NEVER going overseas, could get you called a "baby killer."

    I will say this much - this topic on the episode has had people talk. Maybe it was a good thing because it's making people look at our past - which given our current lives, we need to see.
    MY point was this: once we start talking politics on a non-political thread it can become tricky as not everyone will agree with the opinion expressed. As I wrote, everyone who goes to war and the families they leave behind (and it is said it is the families who bare the heaviest load during deployment) have their own perceptions of their experiences. For some, their voices are represented. However, others are not represented and they run the risk of being considered `in step' with the most vocal. I just want people to know that. Because my husband, life long military and a a Viet Nam vet, does not harbor anger. He watched the show and didn't even think about a propaganda angle. When I brought it up he replied "it's no more propaganda than any other countries patriotic songs.' My Dad is a member of Veterans For Peace. His war experience in Korea never made him hate Koreans. He joined Veterans For Peace, along with thousands of other veterans, including Viet-Nam veterans. Some of these men went back to Viet-Nam over the years to rebuild villages. They wanted to make amends with the innocents. War is hell for everyone involved. For us, The Amazing Race is a wonderful experience because, as I said, we see people from every country and they become more `real', more like us and less unfamiliar. To me, that's a win win, whether in New Zealand or Viet-Nam. So again, I respect everyones viewpoint and experiences and have empathy. Thanks for hearing me out. Now on to the next leg!
    Last edited by redsox girl; 03-20-2013 at 12:46 AM.
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  9. #79
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**


  10. #80
    FORT Fogey jadewarlock's Avatar
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    Re: 3/17 TAR 22 Episode 5 **West Coast Spoilers**

    ^^ except to make it where the page isn't found. I think they got a bit more flak than they're liking.
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