4/19 Show Discussion Thread **SPOILERS**

[steppemaster]

Now that I've seen the face off at the mat--I think Margie was waaay over the top. I'm sure part of it was due to the stress and fatigue of the race.

But I think when she sees this on tv she will be embarrassed. I don't think she always acts this way.


It did smack of "Waahh! They're always picking on me/us" though.



And her insisting on giving Luke all those details over the period of today's installment smacks of trying to get his dander up over a perceived "insult."


I grew up with people whose major strategy in life was to look for insults so they could have a "poor me" response. It took me some time to see that there were many other more positive ways to approach people and life.

IMO Margie is not doing Luke--or herself any favors if this is her usual response to any perceived slight. It will take him a lot of work and much time to purge himself of that kind of "Poor me," they're picking on me" attitude and start enjoying life.


I've been there and had to do it. It can be done--but much easier never to have that drummed into you in the first place.

(Yes parents doing that to their kids is an issue for me. I only think about it these days when presented with such a clearcut example of it. Or if I find myself regressing to that old attitude in my own life.)

[MsDiva2007]

I honestly though that Kisha and Jen were laughing at Luke before Margie went off on them, so apparently I can see her point. I've seen that sort of snickering at the handicapped before and for some reason, Kisha and Jen strike me as just the sort of people who would do such a thing.

Exactly what type of people would that be?

[Jexter]

OK mom, play the "laughing at my deaf son" card. That's such utter BS.

Jen & Kisha beat you, Margie. Deal with it.

Luke gets to throw a tantrum until he gets his way, but nobody can react to it? Rubbish. If you enter the race, you get no special treatment.

Here's where we all get to agree to disagree.

I see everything from a completely different perspective.

• I don't think Margie spoils OR babies Luke.
• I don't think they were upset that they were beat; they were upset with a person who tried to physically push her way in front of Luke when it was clear he was there first
• I didn't see Luke throw a tantrum; what I saw was Jen being unjustly physical with Luke and then calling him a bitch for pushing her away and Luke defending himself
• I don't think Luke and Margie expect or act like they deserve special treatment. What they were talking about tonight was pure and simple "manners". The girls were offensive at the boxes and they were offensive to smile the way they did when Luke signed/spoke - whether they meant it as game play or because of his disability. Either way.
• I haven't seen anything that indicates that Margie and Luke are looking for any special favors. Not one word, not one behavior. Margie's comments were meant to indicate a desire for understanding - NOT favors.

And, at the end of the day, Luke IS deaf. I say "get over it" to everyone who has it in for him. As his mother suggested, he was probably bullied and thought of as dumb his entire life. I don't blame him OR his mom for being defensive. Not one bit.

Kudos to Margie for giving voice to the challenges of deaf people!!!

Kudos to Luke for going on the show despite his disability!!!

[Arielflies]

For me the comedy of this seemingly tragic farce was the local couple eating sandwiches as Phil is telling them that three teams are approaching. That was funny. The double incidents at the clue boxes, not so much.

Remember previous races when we admired those racers who would take a breath and admire the scenery or stop for a moment to smell the roses? Not this time around. And I'm looking especially at you, Jaime/Kara. They have got to be the rudest (or close to it) pair yet..."Run over them, this is a race." That is their excuse for no manners. Pshaw.

In the taxi after the first incident, Keisha, but more particularly Jen said they would laugh at Luke and make him more angry. Their laughter or snickers at the mat was strategy. Not pretty, but there. Now Margie and Luke are running on emotion rather than intelligence and that does not bode well for their future.

The way I saw the indicident #1 was Luke crowding the box, and in incident #2, Jen tried to crowd the box and was thrown off balance when Luke advanced on her. The two youngest hurling insults instead of punches. I'm surprised they didn't stick their tongues out at each other. The incidents made this leg memorable, but I would have preferred people racing hard, not mad.

At least they kept the Chinese speaking Tammy/Victor in check by keeping them close. Although, if Tammy's birds had been more cooperative, they would have surged ahead to the finish. Rather than misguided taxis, they ran into misguided birds. I sort of cringed when Victor played the Father pity card at the one calligraphy stand. "If we don't win, our Father will cry." Victor once again showing he will take whatever advantage he can to advance his team. Not wrong, but telling.

I'm looking forward to the foot massages that Jaime (?) claims are more painful than giving birth.

[HurriKaty]

I have to say, it's interesting to see such varying opinions on one single episodes. I don't ever remember an episode of TAR that's done that before. I've enjoyed reading them all.

Now that I've had time to sit on it, I think.. that the initial cluebox incident, where they ran into eachother was an accident. Whether Luke should have swung at her face, I don't know. Maybe he was simply protecting himself and went too far. Maybe he was being a jerk. I'm not in his head. The second cluebox incident was a result of Luke and Jen not being able to drop it and trying to outdo eachother again and causing a SECOND incident for no reason when they could have just kept racing on their merry way and forgot about particular teams and just focused on winning.

Margie went completely overboard at the mat. At no point did I think they were laughing at Luke, just at the ridiculousness of the entire situation. I'd probably do the same thing. She is far too overprotective of someone in his 20s. Though I have to admit, Luke acts like a teenager at times.

[MFWalkoff]

And, at the end of the day, Luke IS deaf. I say "get over it" to everyone who has it in for him. As his mother suggested, he was probably bullied and thought of as dumb his entire life. I don't blame him OR his mom for being defensive. Not one bit.

I don't "blame" them either for reacting that way. I'm just saying they shouldn't expect it to get them anywhere in the game, or get Jen & Kisha in "trouble" somehow. Margie was looking to Phil to step in somehow and cite some penalty for perceived meanness or something. It wasn't going to happen, as what she was angry about had nothing to do with the race.

Kudos to Margie for giving voice to the challenges of deaf people!!!

Kudos to Luke for going on the show despite his disability!!!

I say kudos as well, I'm glad they made the show and I don't wish them ill or anything. As long as they understand that "he's deaf" can never be used as an excuse or an advantage over any of the other teams during the competition, great. I'm sure they were handed pages of documents, and were explained ad nauseum by the producers that this would be the case.

J&K's behavior toward them was about game-related incidents; Margie overreacted in a way that had nothing to do with the game. I understand a mother's frustration, but she doesn't get a pass when she takes it out on the wrong people at the wrong time.

[MamaC]

I felt sorry and embarrassed for the Chinese couple sitting at the pitstop having to witness this inanity. And even felt sorry and embarrassed for Tammy and Victor stuck in the middle of the two battling teams. This could have been a much "lighter" pitstop scenario with Phil asking Tammy and Victor what it feels like to be in the motherland, etc., yet here he was trying to get two teams to stop sparring with each other.

I think, and hope, that when Margie sees this on TV, she will see that she was overreacting. And I also hope that Luke also sees how he took it too far. Here he is all bent out of shape for being called a bitch....yet he had no problem calling the sisters bitches when he stormed off.


Someone upthread mentioned "Run them over, this is a race" I think it was Christie of Colin and Christie fame who uttered something very similar a few seasons back.

I liked the brothers tonight. They had fun washing those ladies' hair. And they were very entertaining when they were dancing.

[steppemaster]

I have to say, it's interesting to see such varying opinions on one single episodes. I don't ever remember an episode of TAR that's done that before. I've enjoyed reading them all.

Now that I've had time to sit on it, I think.. that the initial cluebox incident, where they ran into eachother was an accident. Whether Luke should have swung at her face, I don't know. Maybe he was simply protecting himself and went too far. Maybe he was being a jerk. I'm not in his head. The second cluebox incident was a result of Luke and Jen not being able to drop it and trying to outdo eachother again and causing a SECOND incident for no reason when they could have just kept racing on their merry way and forgot about particular teams and just focused on winning.

Margie went completely overboard at the mat. At no point did I think they were laughing at Luke, just at the ridiculousness of the entire situation. I'd probably do the same thing. She is far too overprotective of someone in his 20s. Though I have to admit, Luke acts like a teenager at times.

I especially agree with the bolded part.

She keeps making excuses for his behavior--not a good thing to do when you're trying to get our child to grow up.

I think they will both find these episodes embarrassing to watch.

I don't have anything "in" for Margie and Luke--but I do see overprotectiveness on one side and inappropriate childishness on the other.

IMO they will both learn something about themselves.

[meezy]

I honestly though that Kisha and Jen were laughing at Luke before Margie went off on them, so apparently I can see her point. I've seen that sort of snickering at the handicapped before and for some reason, Kisha and Jen strike me as just the sort of people who would do such a thing.

This happens all the time in confrontations, people snicker, laugh and smile whenever the other party is trying to make a point, state their case or offer a rebuttal. It's a tactic and a way of being dismissive of their argument and really probably second nature for everyone.

It had eff all to do with Luke being handicapped, Margie seriously jumped the gun and they both obviously have a chip on their shoulder over people with disabilities. I'm sure life hasn't been easy or fair to either of them, but that's hardly an excuse to play the disability card because it merely suits them.

Accusing Kisha and Jen of laughing at Luke because he was deaf is as absurd, stupid and groundless as if the former accused Margie and Luke of racism over the entire incident.

I used to like Margie, but now I think she's kind of an idiot.

[paridy]

I think Jen and Kisha were just as much of brats as Luke and Margie were. I actually didn't like them to begin with, and this hasn't changed my opinion. Jen is older than Luke and she was just as immature as he was. What's her excuse. :nono